Retired Socialite Needs Parking for Her Friends
Silver Fox
7″ wide x 5″ high
Hand-cut vellum
_____________________________
Karl: It’s a warm Friday morning, December 10th, and I’m here on the corner of Flores and Santa Monica, having breakfast at Basix with?
Silver Fox: Silver Fox
Karl: Cute! So what is your occupation?
Silver Fox: I’m retired.
Karl: You’re a socialite?
Silver Fox: I’m a socialite, I’m a retired socialite. My occupation, at this time, is to help the elderly. I help several holocaust victims that I drive around, I grocery shop for them, and I take them to the doctor’s or the drug store. I just spend time with them.
Karl: Are they local? Near here?
Silver Fox: They live in the Fairfax area.
Karl: That’s nice of you.
Silver Fox: No, actually, it’s a gift for me. It is. I’m very blessed.
Karl: You’re married?
Silver Fox: I’m married, two children, three grandchildren of my own. I’ve adopted a set of twins because their grandmother died before they were born. They needed a Grandma, so they call me “Na-na,” and they’re six-years-old.
Karl: And where do they live?
Silver Fox: They live in Chatsworth. They come to the pool sometimes in the summer.
Karl: They’re lucky to have you.
Silver Fox: I’m very lucky! They’re adorable!
Karl: Please tell me a little bit about yourself, and what you do in your free time, your hobbies, those sorts of things.
Silver Fox: This is my hobby. Going to the gym, and spending time with people who I can help. I’m paying it forward. I love people, and they’re my hobby. Anything I can do to help somebody, even just sit and listen to whatever their problems are, that’s what I like to do.
Karl: *sips coffee* And what brought you to West Hollywood?
Silver Fox: I came here from Chicago. It was very cold. *laughs* I actually grew up here, in California, in Los Angeles, by the gym.
Karl: Oh, I didn’t know that about you.
Silver Fox: Yes, I grew up and went to school here, over by La Cienega and 18th Street. So I feel like I’ve gone full circle now. I moved to Chicago in 1967, where I met and married by husband. We lived there for 16-years, but we came back here because I complained about the winters bitterly, and I couldn’t stand sliding down my steps one more time. So he got a job out here and said, “We’re moving.” And I said, “Oh I don’t think I can go.” (Because all of our best friends are in Chicago). ”You’re the one who wants to leave,” he said. ”Maybe… But I don’t think I can leave them, so you’ll have to go and I’ll stay with them.” *laughs* But we came here in January of ’79 and lived in The Valley, which I hated, because it’s dead. I like the action of this city. My mother lived in my building, she actually lived in the unit that I live in now.
Karl: No kidding.
Silver Fox: I was here a lot visiting my mom and spending a lot of time here, and I love being in this area. There’s life here, its fabulous. When her building was converting, I was working for a law firm that was representing the developer of her building. So I worked with the lawyers, the Department of Real Estate, and the developer. They needed somebody who lived there to buy into the building before the city converted it so it didn’t look like it was a phony deal. I was working for the law firm, so I asked my mother and they offered to help my mother buy the unit.
Karl: What an opportunity.
Silver Fox: Well, she didn’t want to own anything, so she sold it to us. And so we came from The Valley to the city. Happy, happy, happy!
Karl: Wow, that worked out so well.
Silver Fox: *laughs* Fabulous! She wanted to travel, and we wanted to come into town where there are so many people on the street.
Karl: Yeah, that’s what attracts a lot of people here I think.
Silver Fox: Yes, even if you don’t go out, you know it’s there.
Karl: Was it like that in the area you grew up?
Silver Fox: Well, this was a totally different area at that time and I didn’t come to West Hollywood often. But this area developed over the years into a collection of so many different people. You know, different religions, different races, different desires, different interests… It really became a very eclectic group. It’s all very exciting to me, I love the diversity. It wasn’t always like that, but I didn’t live in this area so I didn’t know much about it as a kid. But when my mother moved here, it was the perfect location for her. She got around a lot and travelled a lot. She lived in her building for, I don’t know, maybe ten years before they converted it. It didn’t look the way it looks now.
Karl: So was it a step up?
Silver Fox: Oh it was definitely a step up, they put a whole new face on it.
Karl: It looked like a stereo-typical rental?
Silver Fox: Yes, it looked like an apartment building. The pool didn’t have a gate, and the place didn’t have a fence around it, it didn’t have any of the trimmings around it or the landscaping. It was an interesting building at the time when it was a rental because many actors lived there. There was a lot of action, and a lot of people have lived in that building. I meet lots of people who lived there at one time or another. It was a lot of people who come to Hollywood to find their way, actors, writers, directors. There were lots of different people. There was also at one time, (now this is gossip, I don’t know it for a fact myself) but there was some sort of Israeli mafia, and there was a murder, and there was a body floating in the pool.
*waiter delivers omelets*
Karl: So tell me what sorts of changes you’ve seen since moving here with your husband. How has West Hollywood developed since then?
Silver Fox: Well, it’s very busy. As people escape from various parts of the world, they come to this area first. It’s actually the Fairfax area that attracts them. They move into West Hollywood, they assimilate here, and then they move out. So when I was working for this law firm, it was real estate law, so I got to see where the money was coming from. It was coming from the Russians, the Iranians, many of the Asian areas, the ethnicities of the area are very interesting. Everybody knew where they could go to get help, and they knew how to work the system. So they moved here, into West Hollywood. They came with money, hidden wherever, (typically Jewish people). They bought buildings, they got comfortable, they assimilated, and they moved out. So I’ve watched many ethnic groups move in and out of here.
Karl: Yeah, I guess so.
Silver Fox: So many stores changed to meet the needs of the people living in the community.
Karl: So it hasn’t always been Russian-centric?
Silver Fox: Oh no, before the Russians were the Iranians, and before them were many people from Korea, who then moved into Koreatown. It’s really been interesting watching the turnover. So then you had all these different stores to meet the needs of all these people. It wasn’t as busy as it is now. Some of these stores have been here as long as I can remember. There’s a beauty shop down on the other side of Crescent Heights. It’s owned by, I don’t know, she’s Chinese, or Korean, she’s been there forever. My mother used to go to her.
Karl: Really?
Silver Fox: Yes. And all their clientele are elderly so they’re dying off. But she’s been here 30, 35 years. There’s another shop right here, *points down Santa Monica Blvd.* same thing, it’s been here forever, same owner.
Karl: Do you go there out of loyalty, to your mom I mean?
Silver Fox: To that shop? No, but I do stop in because I know the people, because they were so kind to my mother. So I stop and I say hello, how are you? And I bring them some candy or something. It’s kind of nice for me too because they knew my mother. My mother’s been gone ten years. They were very kind to her.
Waiter: How’s everything you guys?
Karl: Delicious. Thank you.
Silver Fox: My mother finally went to the Jewish Home for the Aging, which is in The Valley. Even though they had a beauty shop on the premises, she would not let anybody do her hair, or the waxing of her face. So I used to pick her up every weekend and bring her into town to go to her beauty shop, then take her to lunch, she’d stay for dinner with us, then we’d take her back to The Valley.
Karl: Aw, that’s sweet.
Silver Fox: This neighborhood has been a congregate for gays for a long time, but it wasn’t as concentrated as it is now. People are out more, they came out over the years. They weren’t always out. But they were more comfortable here, and certainly now they’re really comfortable. It’s a wonderful, free area for people to live in and be who you are.
Karl: I think even that has changed over the last ten years. I can only speak for the last decade because that’s as long as I’ve lived here, but it seems it’s gotten even more comfortable than it was even ten years ago.
Silver Fox: Oh, absolutely. Well, it’s more acceptable. You don’t find as much prejudice as you did ten years ago.
Karl: Well, maybe. Yeah, that’s probably true.
Silver Fox: So that makes a difference. And all these bars have opened up to meet their needs, to cater to the community.
Karl: Has that community changed much? I mean the identity of West Hollywood as a community?
Silver Fox: I think the identity changes with the people who come from different countries. That constantly changes the community.
Karl: Maybe it’s because I have kids, but the place really seems to boom with more children now.
Silver Fox: I think that with, particularly the Russian Jewish community, many of them are orthodox with lots of children. They build these houses for their families. Even the houses on Crescent Heights, those big beautiful homes you see going south, those homes are built there for mommy and daddy, the children and their children. They could have five kids, and 15 to 20 grandchildren. This is not unusual. It’s also what’s going on in the Pico, La Cienega/Robertson area. So yeah, I think you’re getting more children. I think the parks attract them, and we have these great parks. That little Kings Road park makes a big difference. And then you have Plummer Park and that great one on San Vicente.
Karl: West Hollywood Park?
Silver Fox: Yes, which is very busy. You see a lot of children there. So I think that the diversity of people, and the people who like to live in the city prefer this area, and don’t mind living here with children around. And The Valley is not what it used to be. You used to be able to go there and find cheaper homes. That is not the case. People who would’ve ordinarily moved with their family out to that area to find something much less expensive, it’s not possible.
Karl: No kidding.
Silver Fox: Not in the areas that you would want to live in. So that’s why I think that families stay in town more. They put their kids in private school, which was not the accepted way of life years ago, but it is now. They put their kid’s name on a list from the time that they’re pregnant, and they wait to get in, and they pay a fortune for preschool and kindergarten. There’s a lot of money in this area. And the nice thing about that is that people seem to care about their property. You can see that by just driving up and down the street.
Karl: You mean more so than say, The Valley?
Silver Fox: No, I mean more so than years ago.
Karl: Ah. Okay.
Silver Fox: What I have found personally, is that gay people really care about their property. And they’re very creative and very talented, and they put money into their property, which only makes the whole neighborhood better. On the corner of Sweetzer and Waren, that building on the corner, you know that beautiful building, the one that was Charlie Chaplin’s.
Karl: The wood one? Yeah, that place is gorgeous.
Silver Fox: Gorgeous! But before these guys moved in there, that place was a dump! They had all sorts of trash on the Sweetzer side, whoever owned it didn’t paint it, it was just a mess. And these gentlemen moved in there and what they did to that building… they restored it. It’s gorgeous, it’s a pleasure. I have often wanted to stop inside and ask, “Can I just come in and look?”
Karl: Yeah, everybody points that place out. There’s another one down here… *points down Kings Road*
Silver Fox: The Schindler House?
Karl: No, not the Schindler House, it’s on the Northeast corner of Kings and Willoughby, Rootenberg-Markham or something, does that sound right? Anyway, I’ve wanted to get a look inside that place for years but there’s nothing on it. It’s a mid-century looking place, stretches all the way back, it’s just really wild inside.
Silver Fox: It’s an apartment building?
Karl: There’s bricks in the front. It’s not that amazing from the outside but you can tell just by looking at it that it’s got to have some treasures inside of it.
Silver Fox: The other big change in this neighborhood is all of the designers that have moved in on Melrose.
Karl: Yeah. No, I think that’s fantastic. It used to be all antique stores, at least when I moved here.
Silver Fox: Right, certainly nothing that you would be particularly excited about. But what’s happened with the Design Center and everything moving East on Melrose, it’s unbelievable. I mean, who ever knew that we would be living in this neighborhood?
Karl: No, it’s fantastic, except for the employees running back and forth across the street.
Silver Fox: Well, you get that in Beverly Hills too.
Karl: Yeah, well… I’m always dodging the Marc Jacobs guys sprinting across Melrose with fur coats in their arms when I’m coming home from work. *laughs*
Silver Fox: Yes, but it’s such a nice addition to this neighborhood. Now how long it’s going to last is another story. This is such a fickle town, it’s the same with the restaurants. You know, they’re really popular, really big, everybody goes, and then a couple of years later, they’re all gone. Because the entertainment community moves and their desires change. Unlike New York, Boston, Chicago, where restaurants stay forever, neighborhood-places that you’ve been going to, where you grew up and are still there, family owned, we don’t have that. And if it gets old, we tear it down.
Karl: Have things gotten better or worse in your opinion?
Silver Fox: The traffic is worse, but I think the community is better. I think it’s much better, and prettier. If you walk down Croft, or Orlando…
Karl: Orlando is beautiful.
Silver Fox: Beautiful! The homes on Orlando are just gorgeous. It’s one of the nicest streets. And on Harper, those duplexes are so well-kept. My preference for driving is to take Harper from the East just because it’s so pretty. But the traffic is appalling.
Karl: Yes, it is. I don’t know what they’re going to do about it.
Silver Fox: I don’t know that they can do anything because they keep allowing building. As long as they keep allowing that, they’re going to have terrible traffic problems which we already have. Santa Monica Blvd. cannot handle what’s going on here. If you go East where Target is, they’re going to tear down the Trader Joe’s in that area, they’re building a big complex, housing with commercial on the bottom.
Karl: Really?
Silver Fox: Like, 92-units.
Karl: They’re going to take down the Yukon Mining Company?
Silver Fox: They’re going to take all of that down. Across from Target, there’s a MacDonald’s and a Carl’s Jr., all of that is coming down for a big complex. Now after 12:30/1:00, you cannot go East on Santa Monica Blvd., it’s bumper to bumper. How can they allow that kind of building for residential people? The city has to be on the take.
*Conversation pauses as fire-trucks zoom by, sirens blaring*
Karl: This street (Santa Monica) is just unbearable.
Silver Fox: The Grove is new too. I would’ve voted against it had I known it was going up, but of course now I’m happy that it’s there. But thinking only of the traffic, I would’ve voted against it.
Karl: Yeah, you can’t get anywhere on Fairfax now. I’m a big fan though. I like it there.
Silver Fox: It has revitalized the Farmer’s Market. That’s been there since I was a child, which is a very long time ago.
Karl: Yes, I love it there, I go there all the time.
Silver Fox: The meat market was there when I was growing up, the same meat market. It’s like old home.
Karl: It’s a stop on the LA Tour now.
Silver Fox: That’s part of the problem, because it’s so crowded. We stay away on the weekends, we don’t go near it. If we want to see a movie, we certainly don’t go on a Friday or Saturday night because they charge a fortune. So we go during the week on senior prices. We’re lucky enough to be able to go during the week. You know, they’re installing a “Mommy’s Day” there so mothers can take their babies to the movies.
Karl: Yes, I’m familiar. I wish they would implement something like that on the airlines. So it’s just a plane full of kids, and all nurf inside everywhere, with toys and mats and things.
Silver Fox: They could play kids movies and things.
Karl: Yes, exactly. Like one flight a day that is just all families, then people don’t have to deal with the screaming kids. Maybe Disney can run with that. They could paint “Toy Story” on the outside of the plane or something.
Silver Fox: I would love to go on a plane where there are no children. Now, when I go to a restaurant, if I want to be with kids, and of course I love children, then fine, but I don’t want to go fine-dining and spend a lot of money and have kids there. And people bring their children everywhere. That’s different. We never went out with kids.
Karl: Well, being a culprit of that myself, there are some days that you get home from work late, it’s too late to find a sitter, and you just need to get out of the house, you gotta take ‘em out and hope that they behave.
Silver Fox: But you’re not going to fine-dining restaurants.
Karl: No, just the local stuff here. Is this fine dining?
Silver Fox: No.
Karl: Well, the owner may disagree with you, but we bring them here often. But you’re referring to Mastro’s or something.
Silver Fox: Right.
Karl: No, I wouldn’t dare bring the kids there.
Silver Fox: But people are. We went to Flemings in The Valley, which is very nice. The place was packed with children. How could they pay those prices to order a meal for a child?
Karl: I guess families here have money to blow.
Silver Fox: Well, if your parents came to visit, and they wanted to take you and the kids to a really nice restaurant…
Karl: Isn’t that why they built The Grove? *laughs*
Silver Fox: That’s what you see happening, the grandparents, and the parents, and the children, and the little children. And children run around restaurants. That’s another change. Parents allow their kids to run around restaurants.
Karl: Yes, that’s problematic. I actually kicked a little girl by accident once because she was under our table at Asakuma Rice.
*sips coffee*
So, what would you like to see more of?
Silver Fox: I’d like to see more parking. It’s very hard to have guests.
Karl: Right, you have to go out and grab parking spaces with your cars.
Silver Fox: Or ask people in the building if they’re not going to be around, or if they have two spaces and won’t be using one. Once every 8-months, I have a card game at my house. So I go around and I ask different people if I can use their space from like 11:00 to 4:00. I have eight women coming, and they’re getting older, and it’s harder to walk. It’s hard to invite anybody over. So I would like to see more parking in the neighborhood. Even with permit parking, then you have to go to the city, and are you guaranteed there will be a space? No.
Karl: We lived a block up here *points up Flores Street* and that’s all permit parking, and there’s still nowhere to park. And we only had one space with our apartment so I’d have to battle for a parking space…
Silver Fox: …all over the neighborhood.
Karl: How about less of?
Silver Fox: Less traffic and less helicopters. Oh my God, every night I am out on my patio going, “What is going on in the neighborhood?” I realize that the helicopters are there to help but sometimes it’s really annoying.
Karl: People seem to flee here after committing a crime? *laughs*
Silver Fox: Or they commit the crime here. We have lots of robberies, burglaries. This is particularly a bad time. I remember the last time people were out of work, I would walk out of the building and people would be sleeping in their cars.
Karl: Yeah. That’s still going on.
Silver Fox: Is it? I don’t see that. Well, I leave later, and I go out the garage. I used to walk in the mornings, so I used to see a lot of things which I don’t see now.
Karl: We had a “regular,” years ago who used to sleep outside of Kings Road Park. I haven’t seen her in a long time though. She cut me off at the Arco recently, but I haven’t seen her parked anywhere.
Silver Fox: The other thing you’re seeing a lot more of are the people with baskets and their bags of cans. A lot more of that than I’ve seen in previous years.
Karl: How are we on time by the way? I know you have a beauty appointment.
Silver Fox: It’s five to ten, we’re okay. How are you?
Karl: I’m good, I have all morning. Are you happy here? Has the area been good?
Silver Fox: I love this area. Love it!
Karl: Good. Me too.
Silver Fox: For awhile we were looking out by our kids, but everything we looked at couldn’t compare with this area. It’s just such a different culture. And the idea that I can sit on my patio and look at trees and squirrels and the sky in the middle of the city, and not hear anything, it’s amazing.
Karl: Just those helicopters.
Silver Fox: *chuckles* There is nothing that we saw that compares with this. Not a thing like this kind of lifestyle that is offered to us, where I can walk to the corner and go to the grocery store, or walk here and have dinner.
Karl: Was there any adjustment period for you coming back after living in Chicago? Or did you just sink right back into it?
Silver Fox: Well, when we came, we lived in The Valley which was suburban living, and we had children. And when we came here, there were signs up saying they weren’t renting to children, no children allowed.
Karl: Really?
Silver Fox: It was before that law changed. Yes, there was a couple in the Marina that didn’t have children, but they got pregnant, and they owned their unit, and were told they had to get out because they were having a baby. So they went to court and fought the law, and won. But when we came here, it was very hard to find a place, we had a 15-year-old. So when we moved to The Valley, it was kind of like living in the suburbs where we lived in Chicago, so I was fine with that. I loved living in California, so I couldn’t wait to move into the city.
*Waiter clears dishes*
Waiter: You hardly ate.
Silver Fox: Thank you, nobody’s ever said that to me before. *laugh
So I couldn’t wait to move into town, and I’ve been so happy here. I like this whole thing. We’re staying.
Karl: So where do you see things in the next ten to twenty years?
Silver Fox: In this community?
Karl: Yes.
Silver Fox: I am very concerned about the city allowing all of the construction that is going on.
Karl: It’s constant isn’t it? There’s in constant construction here.
Silver Fox: You know the city gets money for that. And I’m concerned about that because living here has gotten more difficult because of the traffic and the parking, and I only see it getting worse.
Karl: Yeah, I don’t know how you fix that.
Silver Fox: Well, you stop doing it. Stop, take a good look, and think about how uncomfortable it is. You don’t think that most of those people who work at City Hall live here? Most of them don’t live here. The City Council obviously has to live here, but I wonder where they think we’re going with this when you can barely get down the street. Everybody’s using side streets. I’m not happy about what I see coming in the next ten years.
*pause*
But I may not be driving ten years from now.
Honesty Gets You Nowhere in LA
Mike
7″ wide x 5″ high
Hand-cut vellum
_____________________________
Karl: Today is the ninth of September, 2010. I’m here at Asakuma Rice with?
Mike: Mike.
Karl: What’s your occupation?
Mike: I’m a video game designer.
Karl: Current relationship status?
Mike: Married… Currently expecting.
Karl: Nice, congratulations. How far along is she?
Mike: *thinks* Nine or ten weeks, I think. Something like that.
Karl: When’s her birthday? And when’s your anniversary?
Mike: Her birthday?
Karl: *laughs* I’m just kidding.
Mike: The 25th of June… Asshole.
Karl: Impressive. I always have to look at my wedding band… at my cheat sheet.
Mike: *laughs*
Karl: Paint a little picture of yourself for me, what you do in your free time, what are your hobbies, what do you like to do outside of work?
Mike: I play video games a lot, ’cause I dig ‘em, and also for research. I go out dancing and stuff with my friends, go out to parties and clubs. I’m not too into the Hollywood “Glam-scene” but we get out to some underground parties with artists and stuff like that. We hang with a pretty cool artist community that I dig, and get lots of inspiration from.
Karl: Are you a hipster, a punk? How would you classify yourself?
Mike: Kind of a hipster I guess, a little bit, because I do attempt to be cool. *laughs* But maybe without overdoing it. I guess I’m a casual hipster. *laughs*
Karl: Part-time?
Mike: Yes, part-time.
Karl: And then part-time corporate sheep?
Mike: Yeah, I work a 9-to-5′er so… Well, or 9-to-9′er… Fucking games.
Karl: What brought you here?
Mike: I moved here with my wife, who wasn’t my wife at the time. She moved down here to work with her sister. We were dating and it was going great, and I always wanted to get into video-games, and I wasn’t going to do that in Eugene, so uh… She was movin’ to LA and I said, “Hell yeah, I’m coming with you, and I’ll try to get into games, and you can work with your sister, and we’ll… still date. *laughs*
Karl: So what were you doing when you came here? You weren’t yet in the video-game industry.
Mike: I was a web designer at that time, and I had contract work at this place, so I came to LA with about 3 or 4 months of contract work. So during that time I started to learn one of the game-making tools, it’s called Radiant. So I started to learn that, and then eventually I got a job as a tester, and then gradually kinda worked my way into the industry that way. Since I knew Radiant, I went to work for a company that I knew was using Radiant, and I just asked for all their junk work that they didn’t want to do. So I was basically their junior design bitch.
Karl: Well, it worked, I guess.
Mike: Yep. Foot in the door anyways.
Karl: What type of places do you go on a typical Saturday?
Mike: There’s a couple places around town that throw parties, one of them is called “Area 33” right now, its down in Culver City, sort of a cool, studio art space.
Karl: This is evening or day?
Mike: Evening. The party starts at about 10 or 11 or whatever and then goes ’till 6 a.m. *sips beer* And I don’t know, there’s a couple other events that people throw around town, semi-monthly, or every other month or so.
Karl: And you sleep during the day?
Mike: *laughs* Basically. It depends how late we go out.
Karl: I’m jealous.
Mike: Well… That’s all ending. *laughs* So you have nothing to be jealous of.
Karl: Yeah. You better go out a lot!
*pause*
How long have you lived here?
Mike: Since September 11th, actually, 2001. We got to California on September 11th, spent the night in Stockton and got to LA on the 12th.
Karl: Can you describe some of the changes you’ve seen over the time that you’ve been here, if any?
Mike: Hollywood’s gotten nicer. They’ve continued to improve that, and kind of de-slum it. The city’s getting built up, you know.
Karl: Well, let’s go through where you’ve lived over the last ten years.
Mike: I started on 3rd and Sweetzer. It’s kind of between West Hollywood and Beverly Hills, tucked in there over by the Beverly Center. Lived there for a few years and then moved over to Citrus Ave. over by Olympic. That was really residential, there was nothing to walk to… Well, we could walk to Rosco’s. We were there for maybe another two years. And then moved down to Long Beach for a year. That was because I got a job down in Newport Beach. But my wife still had to work up in Hollywood, so Long Beach kind of put us in the middle. And that place sucked. Long Beach was full of families, and people were just focused kind of inward, instead of the massive creative upwelling in Hollywood. Everybody in Hollywood is trying to do something cool, or trying to be somebody, or really trying to do something. And I definitely noticed that when I went to Long Beach, people did not have that attitude. And I really missed it. I was like, “Holy crap, everyone here is just sort of sitting in their own job and doing whatever they’re doing.”
Karl: Complacent?
Mike: Yeah, way more complacent. Up here, everyone’s like, trying… trying to do something.
Karl: Everybody’s a slasher, right? Actor slash model, game-designer slash entrepreneur.
Mike: Totally… *sips beer* So after Long Beach we moved back here, over in the Cahuenga Pass area over by the Hollywood Bowl, off of Barham.
Karl: What changes have you seen in all these places that you’ve lived? Have you seen anything different since back then?
Mike: Well, we have changed, so the places that we go hang out at have changed. I don’t know, I couldn’t really compare the Saddle Ranch crowd to what it used to be. But when we got here, I was going to the Hollywood clubs, the Sunset Strip, Barfly… You know…
Karl: Which now sucks by the way.
Mike: Does it?
Karl: All those places up there. Well the city has a whole Sunset Strip Beautification effort going on.
Mike: Oh really?
Karl: Yeah, it’s gone downhill.
Mike: Yeah, but even then, it will still be… I mean, I’ve just kind of moved on from the whole, “I want to go somewhere fancy.” I’m just kinda getting tired of that. Honestly, I go to places now to see my friends. Not really to go be seen, but more just, “Oh… We got a bunch of friends going to that party, let’s go to that party.” So I don’t know, we go to like, improv nights where our friends are performing, or DJ nights when one of our friends is DJ’ing. Stuff like that. Way more small, almost local feeling parties and events. I almost never go to something fancy, where there will be a line, or anything like that.
Karl: I hate that.
Mike: It’s so not worth it anymore.
Karl: You’ve been talking about all your friends, what sort of people do you hang out with now? You mentioned artists earlier?
Mike: A lot of performance artists. My wife’s a performance artist, so we’ve met a lot through her. *thinks* Yeah, I’ve never really created a ton of good friends from work. I’ve always kind of kept them at a distance a little bit. There’s some people that I get along with, will go watch football with or whatever, but broadly I would say mainly the performance art community around LA – fire dancers and… other dancers.
Karl: That’s a fun crowd… an attractive crowd.
Mike: Yeah. They’re awesome ’cause all parties have like tons of entertainment because everybody’s just acting out and being cooky. But there are times where you’re just like, “Okay, you guys, like fucking shut up, I have something to say for a few minutes.” But, ’cause you know, they’re all actors and performers, they totally want the spotlight. And then when you get a lot of ‘em together, they compete with each other for the spot light, which leaves a non-actor a little bit like, “Um… Okay.”
Karl: In the corner.
Mike: Yeah, like, “Listen up!”
Karl: How do you feel about the changes that you’ve gone through then?
Mike: I feel great, honestly. When I first got to LA, I was really worried about what it would be like. I had only seen the glitz and the glamour sheen on LA. Since we got here and have scratched beneath that surface, we’ve found very real, grounded people, doin’ their thing here in LA. Oh, another thing that has changed is my mindset as far as business opportunities and entrepreneurialism. When I first got here, this city was so big and overwhelming, I was just like, “Holy crap, can I even live here?” And then I found my niche, and got a good job and started making some money and stuff, and I felt like, “Sweet, here I am, I’m arriving in LA, I live here, this is my town now.” Now… I’ve almost like dug down even deeper, I’m starting to see that there’s a ton of opportunity here. I mean, I used to think that there’s a ton of opportunity to go get hired, and “do” whatever you want to go do, but now I’m starting to see that there’s more opportunity to go make what you want to do, like go make a company, go get funding from people because there’s so much money in this town. You have the opportunity to think way bigger than you’ve ever thought before, and go create more than you’ve ever thought before. I’m starting to train my mind to think bigger than I ever thought I could before.
Karl: Yeah, well you meet so many people who have done it, that it makes it feel completely attainable.
Mike: Yep. Like, in Eugene, I didn’t know a single person with a million dollar house. But here, some of our friends have two million dollar houses, and they made all their money themselves just by creating a project, and then getting funding, and having a successful business. And that kind of thing just makes you think, “Holy cow, they did it! I can go do that!” So now I start to think almost beyond my station, whereas before I was like, “Oh, I’m middle class, that’s about all I’ll get.” So, I don’t know… I’ve started to kind of change my mind a little… Or at least expand it.
Karl: So LA has been a good thing?
Mike: *sips beer* Mmm hmm, big time.
Karl: I do too. It took awhile for that to come around, but I do.
Mike: We’re you still tied to New York?
Karl: Yeah, I was just bitter about this city in general. I didn’t like having to drive and… You know, I think people, especially from the East coast, come here with this very defensive attitude, like wanting to defend the East coast, and be like, “LA sucks ’cause of blah blah blah,” and “It’s not as good as blah blah blah.” But like, once you kind of chill out and realize all the things you just described… And then you take into account the weather too… It’ s a really great city. I mean there’s certainly plenty to bitch about, but…
Mike: Well, you just kind of learn to blow it off. All the glitzy, glamour, hollywood self-important, self-centered bitches on their cell phones in their SUVs and stuff, I just blow ‘em off now. I’m just like, “Wow, you can yap at me, you can give me the finger, you mean nothing to me. Run along little blonde.” *laughs* “You waif!”
Karl: I like to think of that element as the clothing of LA, in the same respect that all these women are wearing the sequence gowns and everything. They’re always going to be here, those people are always going to be in this city, they may change all the time, but… Once you dig beneath the clothes, you get to the real people here. Although, most of them are just as bad in a lot of respects.
Mike: Definitely.
Karl: Have the businesses changed much?
Mike: Well, Melrose… I don’t know if this is my perception of it or not, but I used to think Melrose was like, way cooler than I think it is now. *laughs* I don’t know if the boutique shops have left or what.
Karl: Are you referring to all the Euro-trash down there by Fairfax High?
Mike: Yeah! It seems like stuff just used to be way cooler. I don’t know if it’s because I just got to LA, and was just like, eyes open, like, “Oh my God, there’s way more fashion here than… in Oregon!” Yeah but, I don’t know, it seems like Melrose is just jumpin’ the shark or something.
Karl: Yeah, or you’ve just outgrown it, it passé now.
Mike: That may be it. But the Hollywood area is getting better and better. I notice more buildings going up, more buildings being refurbished, new bars opening that aren’t like, trashy places.
Karl: Describe the general attitude of the community here.
Mike: *thinks* I would say either do something cool, or go home. People like to feed on each other. Not in a parasitic way, but more like, they like to build on each other I guess – inspire each other. A lot of people here are doing cool, crazy shit.
*pause*
Maybe I can sum it up with a story… A friend of mine, let’s call him, “Rick,” is this kick ass performance artist. He is one of the funniest, most charismatic people I have ever met. He is not afraid to be a performer, he’ll do comedy dance, like improve, if you’re just like, “Yo, Rick, two-step!” He’ll do like fifteen two-steps, he’s just amazing. He’s gonna be famous, I guarantee he’s gonna be famous one of these days. I didn’t know that much about him… *sips beer* Other than just seeing him at parties and stuff, so I was like, “Rick, what do you do for a living to pay the rent and stuff?” And he got kinda sad, and was kinda like, “Oh, you know, I’m like a handyman kinda guy, I do some construction stuff, or whatever.” And this other friend of ours, Loraine, was like, “Fuck you, Rick, shut up! You are not a fucking handyman! You are a performer! Don’t define yourself as a handyman, define yourself as a performer!” So I would say that people here have their two personalities – the one thing that pays the rent while they’re working on who they really want to be. One of my first philosophies about LA was that in LA, you are the lie that you tell people. So if you go rent a Ferrari and meet some people for a business meeting, to that person, you totally are the guy with the Ferrari who already can afford whatever business. And LA seems very much that kind of a town where you can kind of fake it ’till you make it a little bit… Or a lot. And there’s a lot of freedom in that. There’s also almost a little bit of a lie in that, but it’s almost a lie that you have to tell yourself. You have to believe in yourself that you can be something that you’re not yet. I feel like there’s a lot of that in this town. And again, maybe its because we live in the Hollywood area where a lot of people are just really attempting to make something of themselves, or make something cool that’s never been seen before.
Karl: If I may offer a counter to that?
Mike: Sure.
Karl: The host of “Martini Shot” on NPR, I don’t know if you ever listen to him, Rob Long?
Mike: Uh huh.
Karl: Awhile back, he did a segment that touched on how this makes everyone feel like a failure in LA. There are therapists who treat the mega-big movie stars and producers… People who have made it – like hit film, hit film, hit film *taps fingers* and they still tell their therapists, “Everybody’s gonna find me out, I’m a total hack, I’m a joke, and everybody’s gonna know it.”
Mike: *laughs*
Karl: Like, let’s take your friend Rick for example… He’s not famous, but maybe he’s been on TV, maybe he’s had a couple of appearances in some films, maybe he’s done some successful stand up routines at the clubs around here, and he’s maintaining a successful handyman business. So by anywhere else’s standards, that’s pretty impressive. People outside of here might say, “Man, Rick went to LA, he landed all these shows, he’s in movies, and manages to hold down a full time job!” But to Rick, he’s like, “Man, I’m not shit! Who am I kidding? I’m not a freaking’ performer, I’m a handyman!” That goes through all our heads here. “Who am I kidding? I’m a total hack!”
Mike: I constantly vacillate between self-confidence in myself, and just being like, “Dude, I totally suck.”
Karl: We all do. That’s what this whole show was about, we all do that here.
Mike: I guess not everyone measures their success in the same way. Like right now, I’m considering quitting my job and either starting something totally brand new, or going to work for a smaller company that’s not going to make as successful a game as the game that I’m working on now. But right now I’m just hot on making something that I’m proud of, instead of making something that sells and becomes a success by other people’s measure.
Karl: Right, well, using you to continuing my point… In your head you’re still striving to achieve these things and these goals whereas other people might look at you and say, “Man, this guy’s made it! He moved to LA, he landed a corporate gig, he’s makin’ some good dough…” *pause* It’s all perception though I guess.
Mike: It’s an interesting take on it.
Karl: It’s ambition. But yes, we do all feed off each other in whatever way it is.
Mike: Thinking about that makes you want to just… be thankful, and take some time to count your successes, and appreciate what you have accomplished.
Karl: Has the place grown for the better or for the worse since you’ve been here?
Mike: I guess I think for the better. I don’t know why I think that, other than my standard optimism. *laughs* My wife’s business has grown. The city seems to be doing okay although I continue to hear about how broke we are. You know, I have noticed that the roads are getting worse. They totally suck right now. Makes me want to go get an SUV so I can freakin’ drive around on these crappy roads. They’re changing little shit too. I just read about how they’re changing all the parking meters with digital readers that let you pay with coins or a credit card. But also there’s a new rule that if the meter is “failed,” you can’t park there.
Karl: *with passion* I hate that!
Mike: *sigh* Yeah. I hate that too.
Karl: (To city) You fix it! It’s your problem, you’re losing money, fix the meter! I’m parking here.
Mike: Exactly.
Karl: But they get more money ticketing me… so… *grumbles* Hate it!
Mike: They’re farming us for revenue.
Karl: Right, like if that’s the problem, just make them all fail. I’d be less pissed knowing I had to pay that up front then walking up to $60 ticket. Or just make them all $60 meters. *laughs*
*pause*
What sorts of things would you like to see more of?
Mike: *thinks* Hmm… More park space. We need some more green space. And, God, more public transportation or something ’cause traffic is ridiculous. You know, nobody likes to ride the fucking bus. If we had a rail system…
Karl: I know.
Mike: That would help a lot! And then work to create a culture that uses it.
Karl: Well, I think people would, but we’re not going to see a change like that for at least another decade. The desire is here, people want to ride the train. Everybody I talk to says that. But I’m sort of a pathetic example of what may be the case. My company has a train stop, so I could get on at Hollywood and Highland and go, but it’s twice as long a commute. It’s two transfers, it’s a pain in the ass. And I love the train.
Mike: I heard they’re running one down Wilshire? But couldn’t because of the tar pits or something. I think they figured out a way around that though.
Karl: How about less of?
Mike: Less bums. *laughs* I don’t know. You know, LA has this fucking velvet-rope problem. I don’t know if they could get rid of it or not, but it just makes going places so annoying sometimes. Going to a place where there’s always going to be a line, and then you get in and it’s empty! We just had this experience actually at the W Hotel. The W just moved into town, they just completed their new hotel in Hollywood, and one of our friends, Alecia, it was her birthday coming up. Alecia is the type of girl who likes the Hollywood scene, she’s a model, she’s *with enthusiasm* gorgeous! So she wanted to go to the W and get a cabana for her birthday. This is like, expensive. Way beyond what I would normally spend. But… we figured if we get a bunch of friends, it won’t be so bad, it’s cool. So Alecia and her husband get a room at the W. So we got the cabana and bottle service, so score, we’re going to this cool pool party there and stuff. We get there to meet Alecia and her husband for brunch, they have a room, and we get all this shit from people about getting in to meet them for brunch… Because it’s hotel guests only. So I said, “Our friends are guests, we’re here to meet them, can’t we go meet them for brunch?” And they’re like, “Well… *long pause* I guess so.” “Well, what do you mean, “You guess so?” Isn’t that the way it works?” And they’re like, “Well, yes, that’s the way it works.” So they let us up. So we go up and we meet them for brunch. They get us the bottle service, they get us the cabana and all that stuff… And then we hear that we’re kicked out. They’re like, “Sorry, one of the guys who says he’s in your party had a hard time with the bouncer at the door, so we’re kicking everyone out.” I said, “I don’t even know who that was, and you’re kicking all of us out? I’m not paying for the cabana, or the bottles, because we expected to be here all day.” And they’re like, “Yes you are!” And I’m like, “No… I’m not.” *sips beer* So they finally realized, and were just like, “Okay, you gotta leave.” So they kicked us out! But the whole experience was terrible! So we went to one of the nicest places in LA, and had a terrible experience because of this push-pull of trying to be exclusive, but still trying to have some sort of customer service.
Karl: What did he do to the bouncer?
Mike: I don’t know, it was Alecia’s brother. The story goes that the altercation resulted in some sort of spitting incident. I don’t know what was going on. Obviously, that’s inappropriate but… I mean, a bouncer… he’s not like a welcoming person.
Karl: *laughs* No.
Mike: *laughs* I mean he wasn’t like, “Oh, your sister bought a cabana, welcome in!” It obviously wasn’t that sort of interaction so… Less of that! Less of that kind of bull shit.
Karl: Are you happy here, has the area been good to you?
Mike: Yep.
Karl: Sounds like it has.
Mike: Yeah, I love it here. I don’t really want to raise kids here, so by the time our kids are ready to go to school, I think we’ll leave. But I love it.
Karl: Where do you see things ten to twenty years from now? Not you, but the city?
Mike: Man, they’re gonna have some issues I think. Traffic is gonna get worse and worse and worse. They’re gonna have to solve that. The film industry is gonna change here because Bollywood is crankin’ out films like crazy. And the town is just getting so expensive that the people that build the movies… All the grips and the crew and stuff that don’t make a lot of money… They can barely afford to live in the town that they work. So anytime anything like that gets off-balance, then the industry breaks a bit. So I think the whole Hollywood, and people creating movies in LA thing… It’ll still happen, but I mean in twenty years? I don’t think it’s going to be as big here as it used to be.
Karl: Well, you know… Not that you can compare the two because they’re so different, but nobody can really afford to live in Manhattan but people do, and people still strive for it, or to get as close as they can to it. I don’t know, hopefully LA will always have that similar draw to it that makes people want to live here.
Mike: You know, there’s a big Hispanic population in LA, and they fit into the majority of blue-collar work it seems. At least in my experience of what I’ve seen of this city. It seems like 90% of the blue-collar jobs are held by Latinos. I think that will change in the next twenty years. I think it will roll over and their kids’ generation will get into white-collar here. So I think that will change from Latinos owning the blue-collar industries… I can see them still doing well in the blue-collar industry and stuff, but I definitely think they’ll leverage themselves up over a twenty year generation. So that’s cool, at least for all the people who aren’t afraid of brown people. *laughs*
Karl: I can’t imagine there are many here.
Mike: You know that’s one of my favorite things about LA, is how diverse it is. You know, we have Germans, Russians, Armenians, Japanese, Chinese, Blacks and Whites and Latinos and stuff… LA is a huge melting pot. That’s one thing I love, super-diverse cultures, super-diverse foods. It totally doesn’t bother me to hear different languages in our city, I like that. It’s weird to hear people complain, *cranky female voice* “Speak English!” I fucking love that we have all kinds of different cultures but that we all kind of center around the ideal of personal liberty. And that ideal, through all cultures, we can all hold on to that and then get along through that ideal, even when we have cultural differences.
Karl: Yeah. What sort of reaction do you get from your Oregon friends who come here? Specifically gay town where it’s like, right in your face and as alien to them as possible.
Mike: You know, I have not had too many friends come to town, and shown them that side of things. Most of my friends are pretty liberal anyways. The biggest weirdness that my friends have felt when they come here is insecurity about their incomes.
Karl: The prices are overwhelming?
Mike: And people in LA show off their wealth a lot. So my friends from Eugene, who don’t earn much, come to LA and they have their nice jeans that they’ve had for two years already, and a nice shirt that they’ve had for a year, but if you look closely it’s not crisp anymore. Whereas here in LA, people are pimpin’…
Karl: I wear Target.
Mike: *laughs* People are just very visible with their wealth. They wear it on their sleeve in this town. People are as wealthy in other towns, but they don’t show it off. They drive a Honda, maybe with leather, but still a Honda and not a Bentley. I mean, Beamers are like Civics in this town.
Karl: Well, that’s true, the whole car thing here. But I kind of classify that with the whole “clothing of LA” thing we talked about earlier.
Mike: Yeah. Well, that’s just an insecurity my friends feel when they get here. They’re like, “Oh shit, I don’t measure up.”
Karl: Right. Because they don’t get that that’s all sort of the big lie of LA. It’s our thing, to make everyone feel insecure. *laughs* It’s all a big show that people put on here.
Mike: It’s a weird thing because it is important in this town. It is a big show, and people could have an uber-fancy Bentley, and then not own their own home, or something. But it is something that actually does carry weight, it’s weird. I mean, it depends on who you’re meeting and who your friends are, but it can actually have an impact on your career, how you present yourself, and how wealthy you appear. If you’re trying to ask people for money, you need to look like you don’t need it.
Karl: I don’t know, man. When I see those cars, a lot of times I assume they’re the people you’re describing, that it’s a lease. But… I’m still not driving one so… *shrugs and sips beer* Any crazy story about the area you want to share?
Mike: Oh fuck, I don’t know, all kinds of crazy shit… Driving by and seeing some bum taking a shit on the side of the street.
Karl: I love that! *laughs* That’s no big deal.
Mike: *laughs* ‘Cause that’s just a city story! That’s just something weird that stands out in my head ’cause I’m a country boy.
Karl: *laughing hysterically* I’ve even stepped in it!
Willing to Live Among Gays for Ten Minute Commute
Chris
10″ wide x 8″ high
Hand-cut vellum
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Karl: *places iPhone on table in front of Chris*
Chris: I love that you’re so low-tech.
Karl: Yeah, they make it so easy now.
Chris: So awesome.
Karl: It’s August 30th, I’m here with “Chris J.” at Tender Greens on Santa Monica Blvd. We can call you something else if you want.
Chris: Yeah, I want to know why you changed your name too.
Karl: I changed my name because I have a prior career, and I don’t want this to be related to that work at all. I’ve started this whole new thing and I really don’t want it to have anything to do with the other work I’m doing, or have done before. So I use my porn star name, which, you know, is your middle name, and then a street that you’ve lived on.
Chris: Oh, okay. So it’s Karl Clay?
Karl: Clay Road is actually in Rochester.
Chris: Really?
Karl: So… Anyway…. Chris, what’s your name?
Chris: My name is Chris J.
Karl: Occupation?
Chris: I sell motion picture film. *laughs* Officially, I’m an account manager for independent features, for Eastman Kodak Company.
Karl: Current relationship status?
Chris: *pause* In a relationship. *laughs*
Karl: Alright Chris, J., tell me a little about yourself, what your hobbies are, what you do outside of work?
Chris: A friend of mine used to kid around and say that I live the lives of three people, because I’m always pretty busy. My free time and my professional time sort of blend together. In my free time I’m an athlete, and I’m also am artist slash filmmaker. So I’m always working on my film projects, whether it’s writing, or directing, or developing stories and pushing them forward. And as an athlete I’m always training for some event, whether it’s a century bike ride or the AIDS/Lifecycle seven day ride or other charity rides. I’m also training to climb another fourteener… And I mountain bike. *laughs*
Karl: Yeah, that’s like four people, I think… Maybe five.
Chris: So I’m really tired. Oh, and the relationship keeps me busy too. But I’m trying to stay focused on all of it.
Karl: How do you find the time? When DO you do the training?
Chris: Well, in the past I’ve worked out in the morning, before work, and then on the weekends. I’ve had a schedule where I’ve worked out five days a week, when I’m in hard-core training. I mean, for the AIDS ride, I’m cycling a couple-hundred miles a week to build up my endurance.
Karl: Is that like a 5:00 a.m. wake up or something?
Chris: Yeah, and I cycle with a group on the West Side… So, living in West Hollywood, it’s all about me putting the bike in the car, driving to the West Side, and then cycling from there. I have done rides from the house, but… I prefer to be in less traffic, less urban cycling areas. So… Yeah… I don’t know, before the relationship, I was working out a lot more. *laughs*
Karl: Yeah, sure. It gets the best of us.
Chris: It’s actually quite nice to sleep in with my girlfriend once in awhile, and forego the crazy fitness events I do on the weekends. In the past I’ve also carved out time, everyday, to work on my projects. You know, I’d go to a coffee shop and spend a couple hours just writing at the end of the day. I’ve got to get a little bit more discipline on that. ‘Cause you have to always kind of be working on it, for it to move forward.
Karl: There’s always something that suffers, right? You have to sacrifice the fitness in order to get the writing done, or vice versa. How old are you?
Chris: Is that important?
Karl: Over thirty? Although you don’t look it.
Chris: You’re kind. It’s all the organic food I eat.
Karl: And the biking. *wink* So what brought you here?
Chris: The film business; I’m trying to make my dreams come true as a film-maker. I started in Rochester with Kodak, I had just graduated from the Visual Studies Workshop where I got an MFA in Visual Studies. My focus was going to be in Photography, but I started making short films, and I had discovered that that medium can reach a lot more people in a theater than making art photography in white-walled galleries. I mean, I would’ve loved to had been an art star, but I just felt that telling my stories through the medium of film, where image and sound, as a photographer, can come together was what I wanted to focus on. So after four years of being a graphic designer and an art director at Kodak, in Rochester, after graduate school, it was time to step it up and give my writing, directing, film-making career a shot. So I applied for three different positions at Kodak. One was in New York, one was in San Francisco, one was in LA, and like, on the third round they offered me the job. They were like, “So where do you want to live, New York or LA?” Since I grew up in New York, I wanted to get as far away as possible, and I thought I’d learn a lot more being in the heart of the entertainment industry. So I chose Hollywood. I grew up in New York, I wanted to get as far away as possible.
Karl: Had you been here before?
Chris: I had been here on business trips, and LA was never on my radar of places I ever wanted to live. It was always San Francisco, the “queer mecca,” the most beautiful city, most intelligent, highly-educated, urban, progressive… city. I also liked Colorado, randomly. I’m a big fan of Boulder, CO. I used to live in the mountains there. I always thought I would, maybe have that kind of life, but I didn’t know how my filmmaking would fit there. So… LA is where I am right now.
Karl: Do you see that in your future? Colorado?
Chris: Yeah. I’ve been trying to make it happen, part-time, for a couple years, but I can’t financially make that happen right now… just yet.
Karl: How’s the film market there?
Chris: There’s really not a filmmaking community there. The University of Colorado at Boulder has a film program that’s actually steered toward a lot more experimental film, which is interesting to me, but it’s not like I could go there and probably survive on making my films. There’s a side of me that’s also very interested in recreation and athleticism, and those kinds of industries, so maybe someday I’ll find work in that field and live in Boulder. ‘Cause I could see myself doing that, and having a nice house, and still making my films. Ideally I’d like to live there part-time, and even own a cabin in the mountains. If I could get to Colorado three or four times a year, I’d be happy. Just because, as you know, living in LA is crazy-making.
Karl: I think that’s totally attainable. I could see you there.
Chris: Yeah, I love it. Someday, you’ll come out and see me in Colorado with your kids.
Karl: How ’bout I just send the kids.
Chris: Sure. *laughs*
Karl: How long have you been here?
Chris: Ten years – 2000.
Karl: Try to describe for me how the area has changed over the time that you’ve lived here.
Chris: I used to live in the heart of West Hollywood, on Palm and Sunset, which was a few steps from Book Soup and Tower Records at the time. I loved that location because, coming from Rochester, it really felt urban and exciting; the Sunset Strip, the Viper Room, there was a lot going on. I’d have a glass of wine and go browse the books at Book Soup to get inspired by all the photography books there, ’cause they have the best selection. Or I’d go to Tower Records and listen to music ’cause they had listening stations, and it was awesome. I was really excited, LA was new, and I was enamored by… you know… at that time, the industry. Now I’m like, whatever…
Karl: So over it?
Chris: I’m so over it. I was starting a new career, it was exciting to me, and something in me said, “You’ve got to buy a place. You’ve got to become more financially responsible.” ‘Cause I was paying, at that time, ten years ago, $1300 for a one bedroom. Which, from Rochester, $450 a month! *laughs* I decided to buy a place on the other side of La Cienega… I was so bummed to lose my 3-1-0! I was so upset about that.
Karl: I don’t get that, I don’t see what’s so bad about the 3-2-3. I kind of like it. It has some personality to it. We’ve got character.
Chris: It’s a little more gritty.
Karl: Yeah, exactly! It’s got some heart to it.
Chris: So, I had to go through these growing pains of buying a condo, and the financial aches of dealing with all that. I moved into a new round of maturity doing that. I totally wanted to buy a place on Palm, but I went from being in the thick of the craziness to a little bit more quiet/residential on Kings Road. For me, what’s changed? It went from being, like totally gay male, on Palm, to a bit more mixed on Kings, which is nice. Unfortunately, there still, to me, is nowhere near the amount of women, or lesbians, I would like to be living amongst. I just don’t think that West Hollywood really attracts lesbians. Or they just can’t afford living in this area. Um, what else has changed? Honestly, only recently, I’ve noticed that every Monday, coming out of the garage, there is a person in every single dumpster on Kings Road. And these are not homeless people, these are young women that clearly have families and kids to feed, and so it kind of freaks me out. Times are really bad right now. I haven’t seen crime go up, because there was actually a lot of crime in my last neighborhood, but I’ve never seen dumpster diving like I have recently. It’s crazy. And again, these are young women, Latina women, just digging around for bottles for the refunds. These aren’t crack addicts, just people trying to survive. What else has changed? I don’t know… It’s all very glitzy and superficial where we live. That seems to be a constant. *pause* There are more cupcake stores.
Karl: And who’s going to complain about that? Sweet Lady Jane…
Chris: Do you eat there? Do you like it?
Karl: I take my daughter.
Chris: I should go there more often.
Karl: You don’t want to go often. It’s like… You know, we’ll end up butterballs, but…
Chris: Yeah… I never remember that it’s so close.
Karl: So why is this place not attracting women? What places ARE attracting women?
Chris: They’re all on the East Side, where the rents are cheaper, Echo Park, Mt. Washington. Honestly, they’re all over, they’re just not concentrated in one community here like the gay men are. I mean, we don’t have lesbian bars anymore, you know, except The Palms. It’s just spread out. I mean, that’s true in every city, it’s not just true to LA. In San Francisco they’re mostly in the Mission, whereas the gay men are mostly in the Castro.
Karl: The Normandie Room is now Gym.
Chris: Yeah, that closed down. That was a sad day when it closed; it was kind of an institution.
Karl: A lot of memories there I bet.
Chris: Or lack of memories.
Karl: On that note, how about the social scene? Did you go out a lot more?
Chris: Yeah, it was my first time living in a big city. Even though I grew up in New York, it was a suburb of New York. This was the first time I’d lived in an urban environment, so I went out a lot more. Back then it was the Normandie Room, Girl Bar, they had certain nights, they had girl parties. I think that’s just a phase you go through… One would hope.
Karl: Yeah, you out grow it, you get too many responsibilities. You used to drop $200 on drinks alone… You can’t really do that anymore.
Chris: Yeah. And meeting people in a bar… They’re generally not the kinda people I want to meet. Its more exciting being with my cycling friends, being outside, meeting people.
Karl: Well, that’s probably better anyway, because then your commonality is cycling… And not going out to bars cruising . *laughs*
*waiter refills waters*
Karl: You mentioned The Palms, is that place any good? Do you like that place?
Chris: The Palms is like, still stuck in an era of yesteryear. I’m glad it exists, but… It’s kind of a dive.
Karl: I haven’t been in there in… a long time.
Chris: Why are you going to lesbian bars?
Karl: Well, it’s in the neighborhood, you gotta go in there and check it out, see what it’s about.
Chris: You knew you were moving to a gay area, right? So like, what drew you to this area?
Karl: Well, she got the job, and moved out here, and her gay boss was like, “You gotta live in West Hollywood, it’s close, it’s safe.” So I stayed back in New York for 6-months, to make sure she liked it here, but eventually I came, and I think that’s kind of the whole point of Access Mundane. I’m a very unlikely character to settle in here and really grow to love it so much. I really do, I think it’s a fantastic city.
Chris: Coming from New York City? From Manhattan?
Karl: Yeah, the Upper East Side… Very young… Trendy… You know. I worked in Chelsea, so this scene wasn’t alien to me. But here I’ve grown into this conservative, aerospace, geek, raising two kids… in Weho! It’s not what you would expect.
Chris: Totally not what I would expect. And I’ll be surprised if you guys stay.
Karl: Well, the only thing that would…
Chris: Schools.
Karl: Well, you can get around that. But the only thing would probably force us to leave would be, because we need a bigger space. I don’t know what we’re going to do with that condo when the kids get bigger. We both love it here, but I don’t know if we can afford a house in Weho. But… Anyway, this is about you.
Chris: That’s fascinating. I’ve wanted to have kids, but I don’t think I’m going to at this point. Financially, I just like being free, and making my art, you know? I can spend a few thousand dollars on a movie that I want to make. I always thought that I’d want to have a family, and I feel like that’s really important, but my cycling community to me has become my family, and my friends, and LA… They’re such strong bonds. Honestly, if you meet anybody from Shifting Gears, which is the group I ride with, they’re like my brothers and sisters. It’s like a HUGE family. So… I don’t think kids are gonna happen. *long pause* It’s okay. *swallows bite* Mmm, so good!
Karl: Yeah, that WAS good. Thanks for the introduction to this place.
Chris: It’s phenomenal.
Karl: Tell me a little about the attitude of West Hollywood itself, and how that’s changed… If it’s changed.
Chris: Well, in general, I’d say there’s definitely a very superficial, elitist, entitlement sort of attitude going on in West Hollywood. Those might not be the people that live here though. Now being a homeowner, it’s different. I have a different relationship with my community than I did as a renter. West Hollywood is interesting, as a resident, because I feel like there is a mixture of people that come together that are the wannabes, and the people that actually pay the taxes here. And frankly, I cannot stand some of the wannabes, and people that come through here, with their showiness, and their attitude, with their big fucking cars. I honestly have had trouble finding community for me in West Hollywood. Coming from Rochester, or a student neighborhood in Buffalo, I honestly really haven’t felt like I fit in. I don’t know where I fit in this city. I honestly feel like I might fit in the best in Santa Monica because I’m an outdoors person, and there’s lots of women there, and it’s a mixture of outdoor lovers, and maybe I would identify more with that community, while our community, I would say, is 75% gay male.
Karl: Do you feel that it’s always been that high? Has that increased or decreased over the last decade?
Chris: It’s hard to say… But like, you guys have moved in, and more mixed professionals have moved in as well. I’ve never felt that I fit in with the gay male community. The reason for me buying my place was as an investment, and the proximity to my office. And, as someone who doesn’t have a cushion to fall back on, if I needed to turn it over, I could. I don’t feel like I fit in in Silverlake because I’m not the tattooed, pierced, edgy, scenester kind of person. I don’t feel like I belong further east because I kind of like to gravitate toward the ocean. I don’t feel like a Hollywood person because I’m not enamored by Hollywood. So I struggle to find where I belong in LA. My point is just that it’s been really hard to find a sense of belonging in West Hollywood. Even though West Hollywood is where the gay community is, to me, an out lesbian for many years, it seems like its so high end, and glossy, and male, and I just don’t relate to it at all.
Karl: And you felt this arriving here? You felt this conflict from the beginning?
Chris: I didn’t know any better. I knew I needed to be in West Hollywood because I was gay, and my friends always said, “You need to live in a gay ghetto for part of your life to really understand what it’s like to be a gay person living in an urban center.” So… Okay. But still… It’s overwhelmingly male gay.
Karl: What did it teach you? Having now lived in a gay ghetto?
Chris: To really appreciate living in a mixed neighborhood; I don’t need to live in a gay ghetto. I mean, I identify as a normal fucking person, a person like you, interested in the arts, interested in kids, living in a mixed, diverse community. I don’t need to be with the gays. I have enough gay friends, I don’t need to live side by side. It’s brought me back to… I just want to be in a diverse community of thoughtful, caring people, that care about the neighborhood. It’s nice to have things in common with people, and have the same philosophies, but that’s also a given in California.
Karl: Over the last decade or so, has it grown for the better, or for the worst? *looks under table* Am I kicking you?
Chris: No, you’re good. We’ve seen some ups and down over the last ten years, as property owners. I think it’s going to come back, but with the economy being the way it is, as with everywhere, it has taken a turn for the worst. The state’s almost bankrupt, people are in dumpsters, prices at the supermarkets and gas pumps are insane, it’s not pretty. It’s going to continue to get harder to afford living where we live, with the taxes and the high cost of living, and it’s not just West Hollywood, it’s the state of California. Having said all that, you have to find happiness with your children, or on a hike, or on a bike ride, or making your art. We are lucky to have all we have, and West Hollywood is ultimately a nice place to live. It’s important to recognize and be grateful for that. Life is pretty good. The weather is great. But the air quality’s gotten worse. *laughs* If you are talking about what’s gotten worse… I’m all over the map with this. Personally and truthfully, I’m just not in love with West Hollywood.
Karl: Do you want to talk about that?
Chris: No, I actually don’t, but I just feel like, in a bigger picture, you and I being peers, it’s going to continue to get harder to afford living where we live, with the taxes, and the stuff that’s coming down all the time. And it’s not just West Hollywood, it’s just this state. That’s a loaded question… Is it getting better? Financially? No, it’s not getting better for people that own, and want to spend a long time here. But… Is the community getting better? I don’t know, what does that mean?
Karl: Well… It’s a pretty subjective question… Like asking someone if blue is better than red.
Chris: It’s pretty stable. Thankfully we live in a low crime area. It hasn’t gone up or down. Life is pretty good. The weather is great all the time. We feel okay… The air quality’s gotten worse. *laughs* If that’s what you’re talking about… I’m all over the map with this. I’m just not in love with West Hollywood.
Karl: No, it’s all good. It’s honest.
Chris: I hate to sound like a complainer, because I feel really lucky. I know how lucky I am to have the life I have. But about personal identity, if you’re being specific to this location, I struggle with that.
Karl: Continuing on the city maintaining itself… What would you like to see more of?
Chris: Honestly, I’d like to see more steps toward a better public transportation system. I think that would make this city a lot better, if we would get a subway stop, or elevated trains that would reduce the traffic. Every time you want to leave, you gotta be strategic. “What time of day is it? What’s the traffic like? Can I do this errand tomorrow at 3:30? Do I have to leave my apartment now at 5:00 to travel to the supermarket?” There’s so much forethought that you need to have before you leave, and you just gotta be smart about it, or I’ll be shooting myself in the head. I’ll have panic attacks in the car because I’m sitting in traffic. *laughs*
Karl: On your note earlier that West Hollywood doesn’t attract many lesbians, or enough lesbians… What if it did? Would that change anything?
Chris: Um… No, I think it could. Because I would like to see more businesses being run by women. I’d like to see more community spaces that I feel comfortable going to. The lack of independent coffee shops… I mean, as a writer, and as an artist, I really take pride in putting my money back into independent businesses. I’ll go to an independent coffee shop over a Starbucks, and there’s such a lack of that here. I would love it. There used to be a coffee shop here ten years ago, in the strip mall across the street, that’s now a twelve step store, that used to be a lesbian owned coffee shop that I was in once or twice. And there’s been nothing like that ever since. I know there might be some places like that on the East Side, but there’s nothing around here that’s like that. And I know coffee shops are hard businesses to make successful, but with the closing of the Normandie Room… I wish, like in Seattle, or Portland, where there’s this mixture of spaces, I wish we had that amongst the gay neighborhoods. I really wish we had that. Seattle is a great example. There’s so many wonderful coffee shop hang out places in Seattle, and a lot of them are run by women. And we have nothing like that here.
Karl: And less of?
Chris: Um… *thinks* See less of? The canvassers in front of the fucking supermarkets.
Karl: *erupts into hysterics* No shit! *laughs*
Chris: *laughs* I’m filled with dread every time I exit Whole Foods or Gelsons.
Karl: It’s like Vegas, when everyone’s handing you the cards with the naked women on them, sometimes you have to like… *makes thrashing football sprint gesture* fight them off. *laughs* I think they’re working towards that. They’re getting a lot hotter, have you noticed that? It’s like, they weren’t getting enough signatures before…
Chris: You mean cuter?
Karl: Yeah… It’s like they all became more attractive all of a sudden to try and lure more people in, I think they started hiring models.
Chris: Whatever you say.
Karl: Has the area been good to you?
Chris: *hysterical laughter… then sudden serious expression* Yes. Yes it has. *more laughter* It’s served it purpose. I cannot tell you how wonderful it is, that it takes me seven minutes to drive to my office. Seven minutes door to door, on a good morning. At the most ten.
Karl: Yeah, if you hit the light, right? Is that in a car or on a bike?
Chris: That’s in a car. Probably fifteen minutes on a bike. It’s really served it’s purpose in that it’s allowed me to have a work/life balance, because I’m so close to my job… If the plumber’s coming, I can jet home in ten minutes. It’s just so nice to live so close to where you work. I don’t know how people live in Woodland Hills, West Hills… I really don’t know.
Karl: Well, you’re talking to a guy who drives about forty minutes.
Chris: Yeah. You could’ve been a South Bay family.
Karl: So dull, Chris.
Chris: Yeah but… Do you guys even do nightlife stuff? I mean you say it’s dull, but you guys have a family… I mean, maybe you walk to Gelsons, or go have a drink somewhere but…
Karl: I know… marry straight, have kids… life ends. No it’s true… What am I complaining about?
Chris: I know you come from that kind of culture and you like to go out… I guess you still like to be around it.
Karl: I guess I just like to have it available. Like, I have a habit of leaving the house at 3 a.m. and walking around the city at odd hours of the night. I just need to leave the house sometimes.
Chris: That happens?
Karl: I do it all the time.
Chris: Where do you go? You don’t feel nervous?
Karl: I just walk, look at the car accidents, follow sirens, remind myself that I live in a vibrant city, No, I’m not nervous. It feels pretty safe.
Chris: Well, you’re a man. I would. Where do you walk?
Karl: Sometimes toward La Brea, toward the “bad” *holds fingers up in air like quotes* side of town, or walk Santa Monica Blvd, or Melrose, look for car accidents, sirens and things… Any sort of action of activity.
Chris: Ever go up to Sunset?
Karl: You know, I don’t really like it up there.
Chris: Climbing a hill. *shakes head*
Karl: That damn Sweetzer hill is exhausting! But you know, there’s a lot of activity going on at that hour. Around 2:30, there’s usually lots of mobs outside of the bars. Like the other night I was walking outside of Fubar, and there’s all these drag queens out there with all these people crowded around taking pictures, and there was a bad car accident on Santa Monica Blvd., and cops everywhere, and it just makes you feel like you live in an interesting place.
Chris: Yeah. I get it.
Karl: Right… Now… I’d be a freak if I walked out of the house at that hour in the South Bay and I was wandering around the neighborhood.
Chris: Yeah, you’d be arrested.
Karl: Right. And West Hollywood offers you that. If you walk out in the middle of the night, there ARE really weird people out. I’ve been chased by meth heads before, but I’ve never been fearful of my life or anything. There are some weird homeless out at that hour, high on who knows what, yelling and speaking in tongues but… I don’t know.
Chris: Yeah, I think as artists, we crave that kind of energy, which is why we live in LA, and not Vermont, or Rhode Island, or Virginia… or Colorado.
*pause*
You know, I think people want to be here. The real estate’s pretty solid. I feel that because it’s the anchor, or the next door neighbor to the film industry, and it’s position within Los Angeles Proper, I feel like it’s always going to be a solid place to have roots and be in. The one thing that can be the game changer is if there’s a major, natural disaster situation… Because we are on a liquefaction area. *worrisome laugh* I’m not obsessive about it, but I think if there’s a major natural disaster in Los Angeles, West Hollywood’s pretty much all going to collapse. That’s a risk anywhere, but here… I think it’s an actual risk. I don’t know… We’ve been having all these little earthquakes here lately, I’m concerned. *sinister look* Are you prepared for that?
Karl: Fuck no.
Chris: No extra water? No cans?
Karl: No, we don’t have shit… We’re so East Coast, we suck.
More Outside Liquor, Less Soju Cocktails
Mark
10″ wide x 8″ high
Hand-cut vellum
_____________
Karl: What’s the name of this place?
Mark: The Golden State.
Karl: Okay, it’s June 10th, 2010. I’m here with Mark. I’ll just go down the list.
Mark: It looks amazing.
Karl: What’s your occupation?
Mark: I am a bureaucrat. *smile* So, I’m a big paper-pusher. I think my actual title is Administrative Analyst *thinks* 2? Maybe it’s Administrative Analyst 3. I’m not sure.
Karl: Your relationship status?
Mark: Oh, very single.
Karl: Approximate age? 25 to 30? 30 to 35?
Mark: I guess 30 to 35, unfortunately. But I’m the lower end! I’m being honest with you too, I usually just lie. It depends who you ask.
Karl: When did you move to West Hollywood?
Mark: 2001.
Karl: And what brought you here?
*Waitress brings food*
Mark: I grew up in Oregon, where it’s very rainy, and there’s a lot of nature. So I decided to leave so I could get some sunshine and concrete. I wanted to stay on the west coast, and I wanted a larger city that wasn’t San Francisco. So I came to Los Angeles.
Karl: Did you have friends here?
Mark: I did have friends here.
Karl: So it wasn’t work that brought you here.
Mark: No, but I got a job before I came. I sought that out, because I wanted to live here.
Karl: Tell me a little about yourself, what you do in your free-time, outside of work.
Mark: What don’t I do in my free-time outside of work?
Karl: Do you have hobbies in West Hollywood, or outside the city?
Mark: Well. *leans forward* I watch a lot of television. I drink a lot of alcohol.
Karl: That is a hobby by the way.
Mark: It is!
Karl: It’s a time commitment.
Mark: I commit!
Karl: It’s a financial investment.
Mark: Not so much. *says in Woody Allen impression* There’s some bartenders I know that are pretty, uh… generous with the hook up from time to time. It’s not so bad.
*laughs*
So let’s see… TV and drinking… *thinks* Um… those do take up a lot of time. I don’t know, I like to explore the city, go out to nice restaurants. I’ll go on little hikey-hikes here and there.
Karl: Where do you hike?
Mark: Well, I’ll hike Runyon Canyon, because its close. That’s not really a hike though, it’s more like walking. Over in the Santa Monica Mountains there’s a lot of little, good hikes.
Karl: You ever go down to Palos Verdes? That area?
Mark: No, I do not. It’s not like I’ll drive down there.
Karl: Right. You don’t want to drive so you can walk.
Mark: I don’t know, I just kick it with people. I socialize, I’m very social with people. I go out quite a little bit.
Karl: Well, tell me about that. Tell me about some of the places you go.
Mark: I don’t know, it depends. I do a lot of things in Westwood, just ’cause of the proximity to work. I’ll stay there. But I’ll go out in Hollywood or West Hollywood.
Karl: Where do you go out in Westwood?
Mark: Westwood? Um, I’m always looking for a new, little place that’s good. Oh, what is there? There’s a little college bar. *thinks*
Karl: Well, you’re in with the bar tenders, where are those places?
Mark: Well, those are like… There’s a Palomino there which is alright, it’s kinda cheeseball but that’s pretty good. There’s that… what is that? It’s called Maloney’s, but it’s not called that anymore. It’s called something else?
Karl: Is that the sports joint?
Mark: It’s like a chain, but it’s not called that anymore. O’Hara’s? I think it’s called “O’Hara’s!” *Says in big exaggerated announcer voice* There’s that. There’s this new place that just opened up called the Glendon Kitchen and Bar. That’s alright, I ran into the owner of that today. I don’t know. I do a lot of drinking.
Karl: What about around here? We’re currently on Fairfax across from Canters. What’s the cross-street here?
Mark: We’re between Rosewood and Oakwood, number 426. You know, I go here, occasionally for a beer. I’ll do a little, sometimes Father’s Office. There’s the 3rd Stop over on Third Street on the other side of Cedars. That’s a good beer place. Another one that I tried recently over in West Hollywood is the goat’s… The Surley Goat?
Karl: Where’s that?
Mark: It’s where some place called Eye Candy used to be? It’s been 100 things I think. Its good. It’s dead, no one’s ever there, and they have a really good beer selection.
Karl: Do you go there to meet people? Do you go there with people?
Mark: I usually go with people. Usually when I go out drinking, it’s kind of to hang out with people, connect with people that I already know, sort of like…
Karl: Catch up.
Mark: Exactly. A lot of that revolves around drinking though, fortunately or unfortunately.
Karl: Do you find that the singles scene happens much in bars now, or is all online?
Mark: I have my theories on this. I think that a lot of people probably… specifically the gay community… well, I think… Okay, yes for both, like, right? But I think that a lot of people are on eHarmony, or some bull shit, or like, more heterosexual. But I think there’s a lot more hooking up via internet for people that would normally hang out and troll around a gay bar, specifically to hook up.
Karl: They have apps for that too. *points to iPhone*
Mark: Yeah, so I think the people that normally would go there, not because they really want to hang out for the lovely ambiance, who are pretty much there just to hook up, are probably finding other venues for it. I’ve seen a lot of bars go out of business. Not necessarily in West Hollywood, but elsewhere in this city, where there were lots of pockets when I first moved here, of little, strange, odd bars that had been around for a long time, that had an older clientele or whatever. But they went away, years ago. Probably because, I think a lot of the people that would frequent them on the chance to, like…
Karl: They’ve gone online?
Mark: Exactly.
Karl: Are you referring to places like the Gold Coast?
Mark: Well, no, that one’s probably still doing very well. There were a lot in the Valley and like Studio City, there used to be a lot. And then they all turned into straight clubs. On Ventura Boulevard, there was a series of them, and the surrounding area. When I first met a friend who lived in Studio City, I would sometimes go over and see him. And there would just be, sort of like, seven or eight options to offer a drink there. They were disgusting, horrible, and dead, but they were in business… and open. And over time, they don’t exist anymore. Now they’re bizarre clubs.
Karl: And everybody hates those. Why those are such money makers? *smirks*
Mark: I don’t know. I think that someone must like those. I don’t know. Who’s really clubbin’ it up in Studio City on Ventura Boulevard?
*pause to sip drinks*
Karl: You’ve been here since 2001, how has this area changed?
Mark: Well, I think that in some senses there’s been more of a corporate influence. Whereas when I first moved here, it was sort of deprived of that. It seemed like there were a lot more local, smaller businesses. It does seem like there’s been more of an emphasis, as I’ve noticed since I’ve moved here…
Karl: Like, Pottery Barn type businesses?
Mark: Well, The Grove went in for one. I know that’s not technically West Hollywood, but I think it has a huge influence. That didn’t exist when I first moved here. There was no Target. I think there’s just more of a corporate feel rather than less. I just see that emerging.
Karl: Yeah, I think the most flourishing business on this side of Santa Monica Blvd., was Formosa Cafe…
Mark: Which, I love! *eyes light up* I go there lots of times for drinks.
Karl: Exactly. But then Target went in with all those chain businesses. And yeah, you’re right, its pretty much been commercialized over the last ten years.
Mark: I think, a little bit, probably more.
Karl: Do you think that’s a good thing, or a bad thing for West Hollywood? Do you like it, personally?
Mark: There’s a convenience factor to it, but it’s not something that I particularly enjoy. Coming from a family where both of my parents were small business owners, I tend to not like that. And I grew up in a small town that didn’t have a lot of corporate culture, because it was too small of a market, which was actually a blessing, later I discovered. So not having access to a lot of homogenized type… But I think that’s the same thing in general, it’s sort of mirrored the culture in the last 10-years anyway, that’s one thing that I’ve seen that’s changed. Well, even like The Abbey, which is more specified to nightlife, even that became more corporate. It’s aligned with SBE.
Karl: How about the nightlife specifically?
Mark: Well, that has basically been turned into a large corporation of nightclubs essentially. But I think I’ve evolved too, because I’ve matured slightly, so I don’t want to go out dancing. I can’t pull that off as much. I’m not twenty.
Karl: Is that community still here? That community of twenty-year-olds who just go out and go dancing every night?
Mark: I don’t know. Well, you know when I first moved here, I didn’t see a lot of things for like, twenty-year-olds, ’cause unless you’re going to be drinking. There probably are people who, yeah, go out and go to clubs.
Karl: Well, I ask because, when we came here, it was a much different time economically too. So… I don’t go out anymore either, so I wonder if that part of the community has changed much. I don’t know, I mean, I guess The Abbey is still packed at night.
Mark: That’s still packed, but I think it draws a very different crowd, because it’s expanded, it’s twice as big as it was. It’s a lot of people that aren’t from the area. People come from the beach communities, people come from out of town. You couldn’t pay me to go there on a weekend. Like, an afternoon cocktail I’ll do, on a weekday, because it’s a good space.
Karl: Well, we like it because its next-door to the most popular playground in West Hollywood.
Mark: Perfect. Drop the kids off and go get a drink. And then make sure that there’s no child molesters hanging out.
Karl: I actually really like that place. I have a lot of fun there.
Mark: Well, it’s really a strange place, because I don’t understand anyone who will wait in line, why you’d wait in line for an over-priced drink. Well, it’s probably because they want to get laid. And then I don’t understand, I don’t know if it’s on certain nights, or I don’t know what the thing is, but there is like a weird hetero contingent there that’s very bizarre. It’s like… “Why are you there, with your girlfriend? What? Really?” It’s alright, it’s just really interesting. One time I was there and I was talking to several different people, and I was chit-chatting. I’m very outgoing and will strike up a conversation with most people, but I think I managed to talk to every heterosexual man in the establishment. I just thought, “Oh, this is interesting.”
Karl: So everywhere you turned, there was a straight guy? How does that make you feel?
Mark: Um, I don’t know. I mean, it’s interesting that… I find it fascinating that people would want to go there? Most of the time its fine, but when people get defensive, because if I’m just talking to them, they tend to get a little bit odd because they’ll think I’m hitting on them. And if I were hitting on them they get very like, weird about it. I think a lot of people, straight or gay, will misinterpret a lot of my…
Karl: Friendliness.
Mark: Friendliness, yes, eye contact, a lot of people have very poor social skills. They don’t know how to react when people actually talk to them in a certain capacity, particularly strangers. I mean, I’m someone who will just say hello to people on the street. You know, make new friends. So I think that sometimes that can be off-putting for people, and they don’t deal with it. So I don’t feel that I like it when people are defensive about that. Sort of like, “Well, why are you here? You’re here to have a good time, presumably, why are you being an asshole?”
Karl: Well, I wonder if you could look at West Hollywood the same way? The Abbey is fun, hip, it’s an exciting bar, and that’s pretty much what the gay community has done for West Hollywood. Its fun, hip, and is a nice place to live, a nice place to raise kids, so like The Abbey attracts straight people with attitudes, West Hollywood might have the same draw.
Mark: Well, I think it attracts a lot of gay people with attitudes too. Well, you had asked me how it makes me feel, and for the most part its fine. I’m pretty… “Yay!” The majority of my friends are heterosexual males, so I’m very comfortable in that element. But I think, sometimes, other people are uncomfortable where they are, even though they chose to be there, so it’s just very off-putting.
Karl: Maybe they got dragged there by a girlfriend… Like they did to Twilight. *laughs*
Mark: Exactly. I just don’t know the phenomenon. I don’t know why, necessarily, all those people are there. That doesn’t mean that they shouldn’t be there, or shouldn’t be happy there… It’s interesting.
Karl: They’re there to be seen.
Mark: Yes. I tend to get off topic by the way. I tend to ramble.
Karl: It’s okay I like it. Tell me about the community here. Has it changed at all?
Mark: Well… *thinks* I think that it’s gotten a little older, in a sense, particularly as real-estate has increased over the last ten years. In 2001 there was a huge economic crisis, which was basically the pre-cursor to the, what was it, 2008 crisis? I don’t think a lot of things were covered as far as people getting good jobs, and great jobs. So I think that as real-estate was getting increasingly expensive, a lot of people that were mellow, laid-back, younger people might of left, and gone east to Echo Park or Silverlake. I mean not that that’s affordable real-estate there either, but it’s different. So I think that was a contingent that did exist, that no longer exists. Um… What was the question?
Karl: The community.
Mark: So, yeah. Its changed a little bit. A lot of the people that stayed are maybe a little bit older, maybe a little bit more stable. There’s not like a young Melrose Place contingent that might of existed in the late 90s. So it is a lot of families. It is a lot of people that need a dwelling in that sense.
Karl: Has the attitude changed? Can you describe the attitude here?
Mark: I think its pretty chill. I think that it has an identity, an inclusiveness. It strives to be an equal city itself. It strives to be progressive on some things, whether it’s marijuana, or to embrace the nightclub scene, whether it’s up on Sunset or down on Santa Monica. It’s also a very young city, it’s only twenty-five years old, and for being such a new city, it’s one of the most densely populated. It’s a very interesting community. It’s an emerging place.
Karl: Which businesses do you frequent the most?
Mark: I do brunch, a lot of brunches. *exaggerated enthusiasm*
Karl: Brunch is very big here.
Mark: Well, I don’t have to drive, or park. I can walk to Whole Foods, another lovely corporate entity, I have one up on Fairfax, or one down the street too. I usually go to that one. *points to 3rd Street*
Karl: Do you go to The Grove? It’s so close.
Mark: I will for things. I won’t go on the weekend. But I’ll go there. It’s very convenient, it’s very easy. I go to movies. I go to a lot of things on that stretch of Melrose. *points to Melrose Ave.*
Karl: You get that flea market too. You ever walk through that?
Mark: Once, many years ago. A girlfriend made me go. Some people were in from out of town.
Karl: You buy anything? It seems that everybody goes, but no one ever purchases anything.
Mark: I do know people that have purchased things, they also purchase things are these second-hand stores up and down this street. I’ve bought records, because I have an LP player, so I’ve purchased records from those stores.
Karl: There’s a big skater contingent that developed around here over the last few years.
Mark: There is! It’s very cool. I used to have a bunch of friends who used to work at all the stores over on La Brea. The Stüssy and… well, all those stores. There’s some sort of connection with some of the ones on this street too. So I know some of the people who are… into that. I like that.
Karl: Yeah, it makes this a really cool neighborhood.
Mark: It does make it a cool neighborhood, I was just thinking that yesterday when I was walking and I saw some skateboarders. I was like, “Yay!” I like it.
Karl: I saw a half-pipe in one of them over here.
Mark: Its cool.
Karl: I’ve never been in the store but I always walk by and look in. I’m tempted to go break a bone in there.
Mark: I like that you have high-end/low-end shit.
Karl: What would you like to see more of?
Mark: That’s a good question. *long pause* I want to see more outside drinking. That’s what I want to see more of. Okay, I want to see no more liquor license… like, weird alcohol only. No Soju cocktails! Because that’s bullshit! A Soju cocktail? That’s terrible!
Karl: Describe a Soju cocktail.
Mark: It’s like sake, but then they like claim, they’re like, “Oh, we have margaritas!” And they try to make it into drinks. So the whole liquor license thing, I love to go to places with bars, but I love outside drinking. So I want a nice place where I can go out on the patio and have a drink. There aren’t a lot of those.
Karl: That’s the best suggestion I’ve heard yet. Yeah, that would be really nice.
Mark: There are a lot of up-scale, really nice places, there are good brunch places, I could name 20-million… But I want an afternoon cocktail, and unless you go up to like… Skybar or someplace, there really isn’t a very good venue. So that’s what I would love, if there was a proliferation of patios. I think those are very hard to get liquor licenses for. Well, just in general it’s hard to get a liquor license. But that’s what I would love to see, a place where it’s just like… Oh my God, if it could just happen in my neighborhood, where I can just go have an afternoon cocktail.
Karl: So that whole Santa Monica strip doesn’t cut it for you?
Mark: No.
Karl: Too annoying?
Mark: Yeah. Well, it’s too down-trotted, and it’s not outsidey enough, and it’s too much. Like, I want it a little more loungier, I want it more relaxed. *pause* Every time it’s a sunny Sunday, at like 3:00, I’m like, “Dude, I want a drink. Let’s go grab a cocktail. Oh wait, we can’t really.” Because the only places that I can think of have beer and wine only. So I can have a glass of prosecco. No, I want something a little harder than that.
Karl: Anything you want to get rid of, or the city should do something about? Less of?
Mark: I don’t like the helicopters flying above me. There’s a lot of helicopters. I don’t know what they’re doing, but there’s a lot of them, and they’re flying around, they cannot be, I don’t know. They’re not like, patrolling. I want the city to get rid of the damn helicopters. No, I don’t know. I can’t think of anything civic, that the city could do… *thinks*
Karl: Anything? Less old men? *refers to wandering weird old man on sidewalk*
Mark: *laughs* Oh, I like old people though. I love old people. They’re great! I sometimes assist teaching this stretching and kvetching class at this old-folks home in Beverly Hills.
Karl: That’s fantastic, good for you.
Mark: It’s great. Good for the old ladies!
Karl: Exactly. Do you have a good turn out?
Mark: Sure! Yeah! *exaggerated enthusiasm* A lot of them show up. But its fun. Its good.
Karl: I think we have a lot of senior communities here.
Mark: Probably.
Karl: There’s one right up the street. There’s one on my street actually, like a huge compound one.
Mark: That’s awesome.
Karl: So… you’re hard to read. Are you happy? Are you happy here right now?
Mark: Well, I think “happy” is a very fleeting emotion, so I guess, “content.” I definitely like Los Angeles, and I like the area of Los Angeles in which I live. So, I suppose, yes. This is probably the best neighborhood that I’ve lived in, in Los Angeles. Not that I minded the other ones, but they were more of a residential feel. Whereas this has a little but more pulse.
Karl: It’s more urban.
Mark: And I can walk and it has a neighborhood feel, whereas everywhere else I had to sort of drive to get to anything you wanted to do.
Karl: Do you think you’re permanent.
Mark: I think “permanent” is too long term…
Karl: *laughs*
Mark: I think that in the near future, I don’t see myself living anywhere else.
Karl: Well, where would go?
Mark: Exactly, where would I go?
Karl: You are permanent then. *smirks*
Mark: Well, unless there were some reason…
Karl: A job offer?
Mark: Well, sure, unless there was some sort of amazing, reason, or opportunity or whatever. But do I think I’m going to like, grow old and die here? I don’t know, that’s quite a conjecture.
Karl: Sure. Although, apparently if we do get old here, there are lots of places to go. *laughs*
Mark: Yes, there’s one right up the street from you, we could be neighbors.
Karl: Describe the area in another ten to twenty years. What do you see in the future of West Hollywood?
Mark: *long pause for thought* Well, I’m somewhat pessimistic. I don’t see a ton of great things happening on the near horizon. It could be, kind of a, not so much of a hot spot for a lot of things.
Karl: It might get dull?
Mark: Exactly, exactly. A lot of more innovative places may choose to sprout up elsewhere.
Karl: Where do you see that happening?
Mark: Well, I think a lot of stuff is happening east.
Karl: Silverlake? Koreatown?
Mark: Sure, exactly. But I would hate to see what happened to Hollywood, happen to West Hollywood. I don’t think it would be that dilapidated or run-down, but as far as having it basically be horrible, and just night clubs. So, great, from like midnight to two in the morning, it’s phenomenal because there’s lots of nightclubs to go to. But any other time its pretty… less cultured. Because there isn’t a lot of innovative stuff happening there. I mean, I don’t think it’s going to go that dead, I don’t see that happening to that extent. But hopefully it continues to flourish.
Char
10″ wide x 8″ high
Hand-cut vellum
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Karl: What’s today? The 14th? It’s May 14th, I’m here with “Char,” and we’re enjoying brunch at Basix.
What’s your occupation?
Char: Freelance Designer.
Karl: What type of design?
Char: Costume and jewelry.
Karl: How’s that been going for you in LA?
Char: Well.
Karl: You’re all over the place aren’t you? I mean your jewelry.
Char: Oh yeah, it’s all over the country, and Puerto Rico.
Karl: Nice.
Char: And Hawaii. *laughs* Off this continent! Yeah, no, everywhere from North Carolina to San Francisco, Illinois and Minnesota, but mostly west coast.
Karl: And you started here in LA, right?
Char: Yes. The first store that I was in was on the Cahuenga Pass on the way over to Burbank. So Burbank I guess. The second store, when I first started to really put it out in stores “for real,” was in Venice, and that’s still my best store.
Karl: And what are some of the more interesting costume-design projects you’ve worked on?
Char: “Super Dave,” I think, was the best one, I mean, the most exposure. And you know, everyone knows who Super Dave is. *laughs* And I’ve done a lot of theater. Now I’m doing infomercials and commercials more than anything else, just ’cause they’re short and fast and I can still do my jewelry business. It’s more styling than costume design, which is fine too, because I like shopping. *laughs* Less stress. I mean it’s way less creative, but it’s less emotional for me, so that’s good. I’m not torturing myself over it.
Karl: Feel free to dig into your food, *points to Char’s untouched salad* No one’s going to hear the audio, they’re just going to read what you said. *wink*
Current relationship status?
Char: “Living with boyfriend…” who’s unemployed.
Karl: Unemployed teacher.
Char: Yes.
Karl: Where do you guys live?
Char: Koreatown.
Karl: I hear K-town’s pretty hoppin’.
Char: Not really. We call it “Korea-juana.” *sips diet coke* And actually, the people who used to live upstairs, who got kicked out, tried to break into our apartment. They got kicked out really fast after that. They preyed the bars off the window… you know there has to be one bar… there’s a mechanism inside so that if there’s a fire, you can jump out the window. And he somehow preyed that away while we were sleeping and…
Karl: Oh my God!
Char: Yeah, he was all wasted. My boyfriend opened the blinds and was like, “What are you doing?” ‘Cause the guy was standing right there, looking up at him. *laughs* And then he stumbled upstairs and went to bed. We told our landlords and they… First they were, really defensive, like it was wasn’t their business, but then they kicked him out.
Karl: That’s terrifying.
Char: And then one of the landlord’s kids moved in upstairs which is awesome, because he takes out the garbage, and is super-quiet. There’s no noise. There’s not like, crazy Mexican-underground railroad going on upstairs, which I had a very strong suspicion was going on. Not even joking! There were so many people coming and going, I was like, “What the hell is going on up there!” *laughs* So, yeah… we live in Koreatown right now… It’s sure hoppin’ with something’. *explodes into hysterical laughter* Not the hip vibe you’d think.
Karl: How long have you been in LA?
Char: Uh… 10-years.
Karl: What brought you here?
Char: School. I went to FIDM, and I came out here for fashion. And I didn’t even think of LA as a place that I would settle and live. Not that I’m settled, really, but, that I would live in for any extended period of time, ’cause I didn’t even know that they made movies here and this whole industry. I was just like, “Okay, I’m going here for school. I don’t know anyone and I’ll be back to the east coast within a year or two.” And then I ended up staying here, and having, you know, being exposed to all the stuff that I’m doing now. The design and the creativity, I didn’t even really know that it existed. I had no idea. I wasn’t one of those people who are like, *in exaggerated, stoned, surfer-voice* “I’m moving to Los Angeles to work in movies.” I had no clue what Hollywood was, it never entered my mind that is was a place that I would ever be. It’s really weird.
Karl: *sips coffee* Alright, Char, tell me a little bit about yourself and what you do in your free-time outside of work.
Char: Um… *thinks* I go to yoga. I go hiking… which is a cool part of LA.
Karl: Yeah? Tell me about yoga.
Char: Okay, so I do Bikram yoga, which is yoga you do in a 100° to 110° room, for 90-minutes, and it’s 26-poses that… The concept is that you’re cutting off blood supply to one part of your body, and then when you finish the pose after doing 60-seconds to 2-minutes, you let the blood rush back in, and it does all this crazy stuff to your body. Its cool! Bikram is a real-person, who is still alive, and his school-of-yoga is actually in LA, on La Cienega. But I went by there yesterday and I think it’s closed. He must’ve moved somewhere else. He’s a real person, that’s alive still, it’s his concept of yoga and he teaches it to people here. So it’s kind of like, his central, which is very strange. *pause* He’s from India!
Karl: Well, that validates it then.
Char: Totally. Yeah, and I mean, it’s a really… It’s way different than other yoga, but I think it’s great! I don’t like other yoga, I’m not into the incense and namas-de, and the whole thing. This is something that’s… you’re meditating on what you’re doing and you’re totally focused for 90-minutes straight. Like, I can’t do that otherwise. There’s no way for me to meditate, or focus in on something, other than work, for that long. You know? *laughs*
Karl: My therapist has been trying to get me into yoga for a long time.
Char: Try Bikram, because, it’s like a workout too, you’d like it. It’s a time-commitment, that’s the only thing. But… I go to a class at 6 a.m. They have classes throughout the day, and there’s studios all over the place. Where do you work?
Karl: Manhattan Beach.
Char: Yeah, there’s one in Manhattan Beach I used to go to.
Karl: You would go all the way down there?
Char: When I lived in Venice, I went to that one.
Karl: So you’ve been doing this for awhile.
Char: Off and on, yeah. My sister was really into it and would do it everyday. And then she did something to her hip so she had to stop. But, I’m not doing it that intensely.
Karl: What changes have you seen in the 10-years that you’ve been here?
Char: Um… *thinks* When I first moved here, and I had a guy that I was dating, that lived really close to here, he used to live really close to here. And it was, West Hollywood was, a predominantly gay *whispers the word “gay”* area. And I think that people have moved in here with their kids and everything, ’cause maybe it was considered a “safe area?” You know? And, it IS different. My friend, since then, has turned gay, and then moved out of this area. Now he lives over in Hollywood. But, I think that the shopping has changed a little bit, that’s something that I notice. You know, along Santa Monica, used to be all like, gay-dude stores. And now it’s more of a mix of clothing stores and art stores and stuff like that. It’s really obvious.
*waiter pours Karl more coffee*
I used to not go, there was no… If you wanted to go out to a bar over here, especially between La Cienga and San Vicente, it was all gay-bars. And now you can walk down the street and it’s not like, I’m the only girl there, when it really used to be. It’s funny that I would be walking down the street with my “guy-that-I-was-dating” who then turned out to be gay, and I’m like, “Why do you live over here?” *laughs* Now it all makes sense.
I don’t know about changes in this area. Well, another thing is, I remember when the bars on La Cienega were totally normal and easy to get into. Now they’re this big scene, you have to wait in line and it’s totally annoying. I never would’ve been let in years ago, with my dreads, had they been so full of themselves.
Karl: No kidding! Even Barney’s Beanery got a red velvet rope a few years ago. I think Tom Leykis caused that curse.
So… Do you think that everybody moved here with kids, because it’s safe, or do you think the crowd that was here 10-years ago…
Char: …has kids now?
Karl: Yeah, now has kids?
Char: It might be that.
Karl: A little of both maybe. ‘Cause it is a nice place to raise kids. I can see it attracting people with kids.
Char: Now, it’s pretty expensive to live over here. But it used to be… I lived here at one point and it was reasonable. I had a big house with my boyfriend, a 2-bedroom, and it was only $1400. That same house now is probably like $3K. It had a washer and dryer, we had parking, it was on Huntley, right near the Pacific Design Center, which is a really nice neighborhood. But at the time, the rent was totally reasonable.
Karl: I didn’t realize it had spiked that much.
Char: Yeah.
Karl: What do think about all that, and about everything we just mentioned? Did you like it better then or do you like it better now?
Char: Uhh… I’m indifferent. It’s just different. There are different neighborhoods that are becoming more gentrified, and nicer to live in that were scary before. And now neighborhoods that were so desirable to live in, like the South part of Beverly Hills, I would never want to live here now, just because it’s so inconveniently located.
Karl: Well, do you see that happening with K-town too?
Char: Definitely. For sure. There are still rough parts, and streets that I wouldn’t want to walk down by myself in the middle-of-the-night. But my street, even though it’s not the ideal place for me because the neighbors bug me, my street is totally safe.
Karl: Yeah, from what I’ve heard, Koreatown is gentrifying pretty quick.
Char: But, it’s still… like… I mean, we joke about it, but it’s still just a step above Mexico, even on my street which is pretty safe. There are still apartments that are like, 12-people, all living in the same place, in a 1-bedroom apartment. That’s crazy, like… that’s why it’s so crowded on the streets in that area, because they have, as far as parking goes… 12-people shouldn’t be living in a 1-bedroom apartment with one parking spot. Then there’s going to be too many cars. So it seems like a lot more people than it should be still. But, I think… Like, I know my landlord, when I moved over there, was SO excited to have a single girl living in this apartment. He gave me such a great deal on the apartment that I don’t want to move. I mean I do, but the apartment is SUCH a great deal. And it includes utilities, has a washer and dryer.
Waiter: Still working on your salad?
Char: Yes. *takes a bite of salad* So, yeah. I remember when I lived here, and I broke up with that guy, we broke up, I was looking at apartments by myself, and I looked in my neighborhood, and a 1-bedroom, that was a huge 1-bedroom, was like $650-$700 at the time. Now it’s like $1200.
Karl: Well, where did you used to go out, if you did, and where do you go out now?
Char: I used to go out to, well, I’m the kind of person who has one-place they like to go, and I went to Daddy’s which was on Vine, which is no longer. They closed it because they were building the W there. *pause to chew* And so I don’t go out anymore. If I go out, I go to the Cat Club to see my friend’s band play. We just went the other night, that’s like, a social thing for me. I’m like, “Oh there’s a purpose for me going.” Or we go to Bar Lubitsch on Santa Monica and… Ogden maybe? It’s a vodka bar, they have bands that play there. It’s a little bit over-priced but they’ve got really nice booths, and live music, and it’s not like shoulder-to-shoulder-packed. I go out for music and that’s it. I don’t go out to just, get drunk anymore.
Karl: Yeah, we’ve probably outgrown that, huh?
Char: Totally. *laughs* Dude, I get hungover from drinking like 1-drink. Oh, by the way, my boyfriend saw me drunk for the first time at a wedding recently, and he was, like, appalled.
Karl: What?
Char: He was like, “What are you doing? You’re trying to embarrass me!” I was like, “No, I was just drunk, dude. I have no idea.” *laughs* I was like, “I thought I was funny.” He was like, “You were pouting!” I was like, “Yeah, I get that way.” He did not know what to think. He was like, “Oh, I thought you were, like, mad at me.” I was like, “No, I was just wasted, I barely remember what was going on.” *laughs*
Karl: Yeah, my wife and I can’t stand each other when we’re drunk.
Char: Oh, I can’t stand him when he’s drunk. *laughs* But I think that’s a good sign. Who wants to be in a relationship where you have to be drunk to make sense?
Karl: Yeah, all the resentment comes out. *laughs* It gets so ugly.
Char: Well, I know married couples who are wasted all the time. I think something’s wrong with that. I’m not judging, but I wouldn’t want to have that relationship. *laughs*
Karl: Describe the general attitude of the community here.
Char: I think, well, it depends. I feel like it’s just normal here. There are other parts of town that are more… stuck up. If you go to like, Echo Park, people are so, *exaggerated “stuck-up” voice* “Oh, I have such a chip-on-my-shoulder.” I feel like West Hollywood is just…
Karl: Chill?
Char: Chill. Yeah. All different types of people. Everybody working in different types of fields. Not just Hollywood. Everyone’s not talking about their movies, or the job their working on, there’s more of a mix.
Karl: I’m always impressed with how many people here don’t do anything all day.
Char: Well, they’re freelance, so… Sometimes you don’t work. You know what always strikes me too? I think a lot of people here, don’t have to work. Like, their parents are loaded, and they are independently wealthy or whatever, and they literally don’t have to have a job. And so they just shop and are just a total consumer. You know? And that’s great for me, because I want them to consume my product. But I get so bitter about it sometimes. *laughs*
Karl: Has the place gotten better or worse?
Char: I think it’s just different. And I’m not, like… I don’t hate it or love it any more than I used to, I’m kind of just the same… Like there’s certain things about West Hollywood that I love, and there are certain things that I just can’t stand.
Karl: Do you think it’s lost or changed it’s identity? It had a very defined identity a decade ago. Do you think it still has that identity?
Char: It definitely has a touch of it. Not as strongly. It’s not as strongly, a boy’s town.
Karl: So it turned into a regular neighborhood?
Char: When my boyfriend moved here, he was like, “What are those S&M, guy-shops that I see?” And I’m like, “Oh yeah, that’s boy’s town.” But its not as… I mean, 10-years ago you’d drive down Santa Monica and you were like, “OH MY! Where am I?” It’s not as much now.
Karl: What would you like to see more of or less of?
Char: Like what?
Karl: What do you think would make this city better? Or… getting rid of something would make this city a better place to live.
Char: *thinks* I don’t know… I mean, the amount of homeless people is, like, fine, whatever, I don’t get people asking me for money TOO much, you know, like having to fend them off. I think if I were working in, or going to different parts of town more, I would, but I just kind of, don’t go to those places. Or I’m not around them enough to be bothered by it. The intersections that have the homeless-people always at them, you know, like the one in front of the Beverly Center. There’s always people… You know, when I HAVE to go there, I notice… and am like, “Why is that person begging for money and they have an iPod?”
Karl: Right. I drive through that intersection every morning.
Char: And they’re in that little lane in the middle.
Karl: Yeah, that’s a hot place. I bet they fight over that spot actually, bet there’s a lot of tension around that median.
Char: But… The restaurants are still… I still come over here for sushi, and to go to certain stores, and certain restaurants. I go to Hugo’s a lot, which is like, that’s like staples that are here, and have been for a long time. Hopefully that doesn’t change. I don’t think it will, I think it’s more established.
*waiter brings check*
Karl: Are you happy here?
Char: Yeah. I like it.
Karl: You’ve done pretty well.
Char: The only thing that really worries me is, I’ll have to rent an apartment forever, and I feel like I’m just throwing away my money. I don’t even want to think about it, but if you think of how much money you pay in rent over 10-years, and not owning. You could own a place. But it just seems impossible for somebody like me who’s freelance. I don’t have a huge amount savings, I don’t have a 401K, I don’t have health care.
Karl: Well, it’s a total market for a first-time buyer right now.
Char: If I would’ve just had it together enough, when I moved here, to buy a house, they were so fucking cheap! And now, it’s just, unbelievable. Even in Venice, and Venice was a tough area, like gangs. I had my first job in Venice, and my boss would make me park right next to the door. She’s like, “I don’t want you walking down the street after dark. If you’re here late, move your car over there, don’t walk across the street.” Because it was really gangy. And now it’s so freaking’ expensive. And, I mean, it’s cool down there, it’s like this cool architectural… all these different houses and concepts, and it’s really cool, but it’s totally not reachable for a normal person.
Karl: So what will this place be like 10, 20-years from now?
Char: I don’t think it’ll change that much. I mean, the industry is not going anywhere. It’s like movies aren’t suddenly gonna… I mean they’re definitely making movies in other places, and making it attractive to make movies in other places, but it’s not going to leave here. And the fashion industry that’s here is staying here. It’s cheaper than in New York, to manufacture things here just because of the rent prices. And people are turning more toward manufacturing things in the U.S. so I think that’s bringing business here, for that industry. So I don’t know. I’m not really great at seeing trends for the future, like, even in my own life, I don’t know what the next 10-years will bring.
Oh! One thing that’s really changed, I should mention, is the weed stores. You can’t walk a block without seeing a pot store. It’s crazy! Like, there’s more pot-stores in LA than there are Starbucks and MacDonalds combined.
Karl: Are you sure? Really?
Char: Yes!
Karl: Wow.
Char: Isn’t that weird? There’s like, over 500 in LA-proper. *laughs* It just blew up so fast.
Karl: Yeah, I haven’t gotten my card yet. *laughs*
Char: *laughs* You know what, I haven’t either because I am fine buying it from people that I buy from for cheaper than they sell it in the store anyway. I don’t need the novelty. A lot of my friends are into it, and I’m just like, “You know what…”
Karl: Well, my friend, Chris, he’s a big fan…
Char: I guess it’s convenient, and you get your choice of a whole slew of different things. I just haven’t gotten to the point that it’s necessary yet.
Karl: He says he went in there, and he got his prescription, and he walked out feeling like he had just done something wrong. *laughs*
Char: That’s the other thing, I’m scared to go get my prescription. And I have like valid things to get it. I have horrible food allergies, if I eat gluten or something, literally the only thing that helps me is to get stoned. Because it helps the digestion, I don’t know.
Karl: Well, I don’t think you have anything to be afraid of.
Char: Uh, I don’t know. I’d be in there, and be like making up some story and they’d be like, *exaggerated authoritative voice and waving finger* “YOU CAN’T GET IT!” Even though they give it to every-single person. *laughs*
Karl: At Halloween, the one up the street waves people in.
*laughs*
Karl: Well, those are all my questions. Anything crazy happen over the last 10-years you want to share before I turn the recorder off?
Char: I just think the most stereo-typical thing that could happen was that I dated a guy that turned out to be gay. When that happened, I was like, “I am a cliché!”
Karl: That’s devastating, right? You were in-love with the guy.
Char: I don’t know if I was in love with him as much as I was obsessed with him because I couldn’t have him. There was this mystery that he wouldn’t let me in on. But, in the month after-the-fact, I was like, “Oh my God, I’ve become a cliché of Los Angeles.” This all happened in West Hollywood on Alfred Street. In the thick of it all, I didn’t realize what was going on. How dumb was I? But… It’s better. He’s better free and… gayly walking around town. *laughs*
Karl: How long did you date him for?
Char: Off and on for 4-years. I didn’t live with him. We would, be dating, and then we’d break up for some reason or another, and he would literally flee the city, and like, go to New York, or go home for months-at-a-time, because he couldn’t handle what was going on. He couldn’t tell me, obviously. And this went on for 4-years. He’d even come and cause problems with other people that I was dating. And they would be like, “Well, he is so into you, and you’re still into him.” With two different people, it caused problems. And then he’d sweep in afterwards and save me, and be there for me, and we’d be dating again. And then I just got it out of him at one point. Something happened. I knew that something sketchy was going on, and all of a sudden I just knew what it was and, like, yelled, “Are you gay” at him until he said, “Yes!” *laughs* And in hindsight, it was all very dramatic, I fell down on the floor and cried. There’s nothing like that, like wondering what is going on and you don’t know. It answered so many questions.
Karl: Did you think he was cheating on you or something?
Char: No, I thought that he didn’t think I was attractive enough, so I was obsessively exercising, and fasting, and he didn’t like my dreadlocks so I cut my dreadlocks off. And just everything. I thought that I wasn’t good enough for him, when really it was just that I was…
Karl: A girl.
Char: A girl. So I would NEVER be good enough. *laughs* I laugh about it now, but after he told me, I went through these stages of grieving. But I’m definitely distanced from him now. And, that’s fine. For a long time, I had to have him in my life, but now I’m just kinda like… *shrugs* It’s fine.
*pause*
He’s fucking crazy. I don’t need it. I’m trying to be stable. *laughs* TRYING to be.
Karl: Are any of us, really?
Char: No.
Arizona-Outcast Finds Little-More than Happiness
Leonardo
7″ wide x 5″ high
Hand-cut vellum
___________
Karl: Its April 30th, 2010 and we’re sitting on an uncomfortable bench in front of Gelson’s on Santa Monica Blvd. I’m here with?
Abigail: Abigail.
Karl: And who is your little friend here? *nods to yapping Chihuahua in Abigail’s lap*
Abigail: This is Leonardo da Vinci.
Karl: How old are you, Abigail?
Abigail: 44
Karl: What would you say your occupation is? I take it you’re freelancing odd jobs at the moment? *refers to “HOMELESS, WILL WORK” sign that Leonardo is sitting on*
Abigail: I’m just trying to survive, that’s all.
Karl: What did you do before you became homeless?
Abigail: Nails.
Karl: Oh okay, so that’s your gig? There are probably a lot of opportunities for that here, no?
*hopeless shrug from Abigail*
Karl: You and I first met here, outside of Gelson’s.
Abigail: Yes. I remember you.
Karl: So where do you live?
Abigail: I don’t live anywhere, I’m homeless.
Karl: Uh, right. Sorry. But… where do you stay, I guess, is what I’m asking? Where do you sleep?
Abigail: I have an old car parked down the street. I sleep in my car.
Karl: How long have you been here now?
Abigail: I’ve been here probably 4-weeks. I came here for a little while, went back to Arizona and I was like, *groan* it was the same thing, I was unhappy, and I was depressed while I was there. I stayed with a family member and I just sat there and ate the whole time.
Karl: Has the community been nice to you? Welcoming?
Abigail: Very nice, very kind, very generous. Very helpful, I mean, when I first got here, they weren’t at all. And they changed since I came here. It seems like, when I first got here they weren’t, you know… They wouldn’t even tell me where stuff was, I couldn’t get anyone to help me at all. In fact they wouldn’t even talk to me. I would ask them, “Do you know where this is?” And they would just… *makes motion of someone sticking their nose up in the air*
Karl: This is people walking down the street?
Abigail: Yeah, I would ask, “Is there a gas station near by?” And they would just…
Karl: Ignore you.
Abigail: Yeah, they would just turn away. And then, after a couple weeks, they all started, everybody started giving directions, and the next thing you know, I was opening the door for somebody, and everybody started opening doors for everybody. Seems like they got a lot nicer. Seems like I saw a change after I was here for awhile, I saw people getting kinder, nicer, more giving. Yeah… it seems like people got a lot nicer.
Karl: Maybe its the weather. *laughs* It was pretty cold 4-weeks ago. Is there any one-person in particular that you’ve met, who stands out?
Abigail: Just, people who bought food for my dog, good food, you know, the canned food. I can’t afford that.
Karl: Does that happen often?
Abigail: Well, when I hold the sign, they’ll help me.
Karl: So what brought you here, specifically, to West Hollywood?
Abigail: When I was in Arizona, I was applying to a lot of jobs here, online, and I got a lot of requests for interviews. More so than there, there I couldn’t get anything. So I thought, “Well, maybe I have more of a chance,” here. Then I wanted to try the entertainment business which I’ve never had an opportunity to try.
Karl: Are you an actor?
Abigail: I think so. I’m a very intense person. Sometimes I have some strong emotions. I can summon them up easily. I can get them to come, at any second, I can bring my emotions, you know… You know what I mean.
Karl: You can summon up the characters.
Abigail: Yes, I can do that. So maybe that was my calling, maybe I missed that.
Karl: Have you had any bites? Have you been auditioning?
Abigail: Um, I am having trouble with my pictures. First of all I couldn’t get a photographer to… well, it takes money, you gotta have money to do that. And, if you can’t find anybody to help you with that, you gotta find the money, or gotta get a job. It takes money to do that. You know, so it’s hard, it’s not easy. Nobody who ever made it, very few, maybe Kim Kardashian, or Paris Hilton… *pause*
Karl: So you’re shooting pretty high, huh?
Abigail: No, I’m just saying, they’re celebrities, but they already had money. A lot of the actors, they were homeless. There are a lot of big names who were just regular people, their families didn’t have money. For instance, Jewel was homeless.
Karl: Really? I didn’t know that.
Abigail: Yeah. There’s a lot of them who were just… starving. There was one of them, all he could afford to eat was potatoes.
Karl: So, how do people… do you have a card, or a website for people? How does a potential employer call you back?
Abigail: That’s the problem. Hopefully they’ll give me the message. I mean, I know I can get extra work.
Karl: Yeah, a lot of people do that here.
Abigail: Online, I have this website that I signed up on and I’ve been getting a lot of emails from casting directors. They’ll email me and tell me the address to send my head shot and information to.
Karl: Oh good. I didn’t realize you were online. How do you check your email?
Abigail: No, I can get online. The library has a computer.
Karl: So what do you do at night when you’re not working.
Abigail: I go to sleep at about 7:00. I don’t really do too much. I just… try to get money, try to take care of myself, get my showers. I just try to survive. Right now, I don’t know what to do until that changes. I don’t understand, I tried to get social security, I couldn’t get it. Couldn’t get any welfare. I wasn’t able to get a hearing before a judge to get social security. So what else am I supposed to do?
Karl: Out of curiosity, what does West Hollywood do for people in your situation?
Abigail: Well, I went there today and she didn’t really…
Karl: Where’s “there?” A shelter? City Hall?
Abigail: Yeah. Everyone told me to go there. She said they had a room, at Social Services, that they would take me back in a room, but she didn’t take me back there.
Karl: You went in, you said, “I need help,” and they kicked you out?
Abigail: Well, she didn’t kick me out, but she gave me a pamphlet to this other place, “PATH,” which seems nice, but… I don’t know. It’s just, so frustrating. I guess I could go to someplace called PATH, but they wouldn’t help me with money, or anything, but I guess I would just, have a bed there.
Karl: You don’t want that? Well, you have your car to worry about I guess.
Abigail: It might get stolen.
Karl: Do you have a lot of stuff?
Abigail: I’ve got what I need. As long as I’m with it.
Karl: Are you medicated?
Abigail: No.
Karl: Oh, good. So you don’t have to worry about prescriptions running out, or immediate medical expenses.
Abigail: No. I could get them, if they worked. But they had me on some medicine and it didn’t work.
Karl: What are you diagnosed with?
Abigail: *gets choked up*
Karl: It’s okay. You don’t have to tell me.
Abigail: Well, I was diagnosed with Attention Defecate Disorder several years ago. And I had this prescribed medication for that, and then all of a sudden they decided I was a schizophrenic. I really don’t understand it. It doesn’t make any sense, unless I’ve experienced severe identity theft.
Karl: I’m sorry to hear that.
Abigail: That’s okay, it’s not your fault.
Karl: Well, Abigail, what could the city do to improve things for people in your situation?
Abigail: The homeless, or mentally ill?
Karl: Both… either.
Abigail: They really can’t help. All they can really do is let me do what I’ve been doing. The police have been doing a great job, they’ve been very helpful. They’re not trying to give me a ticket for something. I mean, I don’t really know… This one girl came up and said, “Oh, they’ll just write you a check over there.” *points to City Hall* I thought that was a little strange. Do they do that?
Karl: I don’t know, but if they do, we should probably head over there. *laughs*
Abigail: Oh, the only big issue I’ve had with this city is the parking. They gave me a parking ticket, and… I probably could’ve paid… you know… what I needed was to make payments on the ticket. I could’ve paid it, but slowly, maybe $10, $20 a month.
Karl: What was it, $60 or something?
Abigail: It was an $80 ticket.
Karl: Ouch.
Abigail: But, this was the problem. And if they could do this, it would probably help a lot of people… If they could set up payment-plans for people, even if they charged a little extra for it, oh, that would help people a lot. Because that parking… it is just…
Karl: Yeah, they really get ya.
Abigail: It’s crazy. And they don’t give anybody any chances. They assume everybody’s wealthy, and they’re not. I said, “Sometimes, I don’t have any income, can I set up a payment plan?” They said, “No, you have to pay the ticket first to get a hearing.” I said, “Oh, I’m poor, so I have to pay the ticket so I can get a hearing to get it dropped.”
Karl: And then what do they do, give you a check?
Abigail: Yeah. And I told her I can’t get the money back at the bank. I said, “You know, I can probably try to muster up $80, but, I probably won’t be able to get the money back.” So if they could let people set up payment plans, that would be huge.
*Man in old-junker stops in front of our bench and propositions Abigail. She refuses and rolls her eyes.*
Karl: Encounter many weirdos? Probably a ton of ‘em here?
Abigail: Just homeless people.
Karl: Other homeless?
Abigail: Yeah. They follow me around a lot.
Karl: Oh really? No trouble though, right?
Abigail: I think some of them are trouble. They wanted to sell my dog out from under me and stuff.
Karl: No.
Abigail: I had troubles with some of them. They seemed to know that I was outside too… they just… weren’t very nice to me, some of them.
Karl: Does that happen late at night?
Abigail: No, it was during the day. They knew about my situation, but, I’m going to go back to Arizona with my son.
Karl: You have a son? Is he here?
Abigail: No, he’s not here.
Karl: Sure, you want to be near him.
Abigail: Well, just for a couple weeks or so… See if I can get another, something going on.
*Leonardo explodes into yapping at an approaching wheaten terrier*
Karl: Um, what are some of your favorite places to go?
Abigail: I like the Beverly Hills Hotel.
Karl: Yeah, it’s really nice over there.
Abigail: I like to go in there, it’s pretty.
Karl: Have you been up to the Sunset Strip?
Abigail: *shakes head*
Karl: Oh, you should walk up there, it’s cool.
Abigail: Yeah?
Karl: Yeah, you might like it. You just walk up… *points north toward Sunset* You can see the hotels up there *squints and points at The Mondrian* You see ‘em?
Abigail: Mmm, hmm
*Leonardo again, Abigail pats his back and holds him tight*
Karl: Yeah, if you just walk up the hill there, that’s a famous street up there. There are a lot of nice hotels up there. It’s fun. They have gorgeous lobbies… there’s one called The Standard?
Abigail: Oh, I’ve stayed there before.
Karl: Really? Nice, I’ve never seen the rooms myself.
Abigail: That’s a really funny place. *laughs*
Karl: Yeah, it is. They’ve got that great patio.
So… are you happy here?
Abigail: Yeah. I’m happy here. I just need to get it together. It’s hard when you don’t have any money. A lot of my money went quick when I got here, trying to find places, trying to find where things are, having to go back and forth, and back again. I wasted a lot of my money.
Karl: Can you go back to Arizona and earn more there?
Abigail: Well, maybe not return with more, I can only get money in California. I can’t get money in Arizona. Isn’t that funny?
*Angry male-voice emits from building across the street*
Male voice: Shut up that yapping dog!
*Abigail sighs*
Karl: Fuck ‘im. Don’t worry about it. I get the same thing when my 3-year old is crying out here.
Abigail: He’ll get what he deserves.
Karl: So… *pauses between barks* Are you wanted there or something?
Abigail: No. It’s real shady. They’re saying I’m a felon there, but I didn’t get arrested or anything.
Karl: Who’s “they?” The police?
Abigail: It’s on the computers, the computers are weird there. The computers there don’t… *stares into distance*
Karl: Jive?
Abigail: *LAUGHS* No… they don’t jive! No, they don’t. They don’t jive at all. I wish they would do something about it, but nobody’s… I mean, look what they’re doing over there… I mean… Aren’t they like, firing 100 police officers?
Karl: I don’t know much about Arizona’s politics. I know that we’re boycotting travel to Arizona over their anti-immigration law. Have you read about that?
Abigail: No, I haven’t. The only problem is, some places here are doing the same thing. Not the good people. The celebrities and stuff, they’re all good. They’re good, you know what I’m saying? They’re… *drifts off into deep thought*
Karl: Helping?
Abigail: Yeah! I mean, they wouldn’t be involved in anything like that, but there’s places here that are doing the same thing. That’s where it’s headed, the same as Arizona. The same thing they’re doing here is going to cause the same problems they’re having in Arizona. The same thing’s gonna happen, except for the people here will be able to sustain everything. They’ll be able to keep it together. There’s enough money here to keep everything together.
Karl: I sure hope so. On that note, where do you see West Hollywood 20-years from now, the way things are going? Do you see this place flourishing, or falling apart?
Abigail: It all depends on the choices they make.
Karl: What choices could be made that would cause the city to fall apart?
Abigail: Not following the same set of rules. If you don’t follow the same thing for everybody. If you’re in the government, you have to follow the same rules as everyone else.
Karl: Are you referring to corruption? Or… special treatment, you know, for celebrities?
Abigail: No, they can do that. They have enough problems already, they deserve special treatment.
*Leonardo yaps at poodle across the street*
I’ve experienced the opposite of that treatment, so if you can get that, you deserve it.
Karl: How so? You’re not famous enough? *joking smile*
Abigail: No. I wouldn’t say I’m a celebrity, but it seems like a lot of people know who I am. In New York, people knew who I was.
Karl: Really? You spent time in New York? Did you like it there?
Abigail: Yeah, I loved it there. People knew who I was there.
Karl: It’s a nice place, a good town. You didn’t want to stay there?
Abigail: I can’t afford there.
Karl: Yeah, it’s expensive.
Abigail: It’s like here. I mean, before I would’ve been okay, but my money got stolen here. I had to start putting my money in other places.
Karl: Oh no, that’s terrible.
Abigail: Yeah, that’s why I’m so poor. My money got stolen. A lot of it. I had about $300 or $400 stolen.
Karl: Out of your car?
Abigail: Out of my purse.
Karl: Ugh… *wince* that’s devastating. I’m sorry to hear that.
Abigail: That’s okay. But that’s what makes it so hard. I was able to get it, but then it’s just…
Karl: Gone. Yeah, my mom and I were in London when I was a kid and she got ripped off too, and we didn’t have any money. It’s frightening, especially in a strange place. Yeah, it’s terrible when that happens.
*pause*
Well, I’d better get back to work. I’ll let you go, but… is there anything else you want to leave me with?
Abigail: No, but if you think of anything else, any ideas, like I said, I’ve had a lot of things happen to me, I’ve been in a lot of situations.
Karl: No, I can tell, you’re a very interesting person. You’ve been through a lot of things. Say, would you let me take your picture, with those flowers behind you? *points at floral bush behind bench* It’s fine to say no, you don’t have to, but I like to do portraits of people, and you would be a great one.
Abigail: Maybe another time, I don’t have any make-up on.
Karl: Well, I think you look beautiful, but that’s fine, I know how ladies are. *laughs* No problem. How about just of Leonardo then?
Abigail: *laughs* We look awful.
Karl: You look fantastic.
Retire to Weho, Discover Euro-cruises
Lee
10″ wide x 8″ high
Hand-cut vellum
_____________
Lee: Too noisy here?
Karl: No, no, it’s perfect.
*interlude to discuss pros and cons of various voice-recording iPhone apps*
Lee: Go ahead…
Karl: Oh.. okay, so what’s today? The 30th… It’s April 30th, 2010 and we’re… what is the name of this place anyway? *walks to front of restaurant to look at sign* Marco’s.
Lee: Yeah, we’ve eaten here a couple times. They’ve shut down that side of it since then. *points at abandoned building across Havenhurst Dr.*
Karl: So we’re at Marco’s in West Hollywood with “Lee.” Lee, what would say your occupation is?
Lee: Broadcast Engineer.
Karl: Current relationship status?
Lee: About 30-years with same partner, Dave, around 1981, whenever that happened, whatever that computes to be.
Karl: How long have you lived here in West Hollywood?
Lee: About 5-years… Actually, I worked here 2-years, actually we were looking for a house down here, and I rented for about a year while we were looking for a house, I think I ended up taking 2-years, and at the time I was on my second retirement working for Vulcan, up on Beverly Crest.
Karl: Did they move you here?
Lee: No, they didn’t.
Karl: Where did you come from?
Lee: Seattle.
Karl: And why West Hollywood? Because the work brought you here?
Lee: No, because of the, uh… environment.
Karl: It’s a nice place to live, although I’ve heard Seattle is nice too.
Lee: Seattle’s really nice if you don’t mind 9-months of overcast. There’s a high suicide-rate there. It’s very depressing if you’re interested in being outside. But Seattle’s been very good to me, I worked with a lot of cool people, I made a lot of money, and it’s a place you’d want to work because you can’t do much else.
Karl: I went to school in Rochester, New York, so I know the whole overcast thing well.
Lee: *laughs* Same thing.
Karl: Well, tell me a little about yourself, unrelated to work, what do you do in your free time, what do you and Dave like to do together?
Lee: Currently, we’re on a cruise-mania. We always thought cruises would be confining, and we never really tried that, we always took a lot of land-trips, and now we have discovered cruises and our good friend, Eric, who lives around the corner from us, does good cruises. He put us on some of the best cruises, we started out with a company called, Crystal Lines, here in LA and it’s pretty neat. It’s nice to only have to pack once, and so we’ve been on about three of those. We have one scheduled, going down the Rhine River through Europe, and after that next year, we have one scheduled to go through South America.
Karl: Oh my God.
Lee: Yeah. Ca-ching, ca-ching. *laughs*
Karl: I actually have never been on a cruise. I hear they’re awesome.
Lee: We were really skeptical. The first Crystal cruise we went on, we sat down at a table of eight, (Dave can tell this better than I can), so we didn’t know who we were eating with, and there’s some pretty crazy people we’re eating with, there’s this wild, crazy lady, oh God, where was she from? Anyway, another who used to be… he used to work for the President, you know, security for the President, and we thought he was just totally out-to-lunch. The guy was so politically inclined, we didn’t like the whole thing. But we ended up cruising with him the last two or three cruises.
Karl: *laughs* So you hit it off.
Lee: Yeah, we did hit it off, in the end. It’s interesting. Dave pretty much does his thing, and I do my thing. I dink around in my junk room, and he shops. *laughs* That’s what we do in our spare time.
Karl: There’s supposed to be a nice one that goes up to Alaska.
Lee: We did that one.
Karl: Really?
Lee: Not only the cruise, but also the land version. We helicoptered into a lodge, inaccessible by land, and they helicoptered us up to go river-rafting.
Karl: Yeah, we’ll get there one of these days. Maybe in 20-years or so. I have a friend up there and I keep saying I’m going to go visit him.
*pause*
So what do you do when you’re here?
Lee: Well, I do a little bit of play with programming, and electronics, gadgets, whatever. Good question… We don’t know what we do with our time, but it goes fast. All of a sudden, I get up, make breakfast, that used to happen at 6:00, and be over by 7:00 or 8:00, now it’s creeped up to maybe ending at 9:00.
*Lee’s phone erupts into the “Sex in the City” theme song*
Karl: It’s okay, you can take that.
Lee: I don’t know who that is.
Karl: So you’ve been here 7-years then.
Lee: No, I think we bought the place in 2004 but we didn’t move into it until 2005, so its been 6-years.
Karl: Well, what changes have you seen around the area? You can interpret that question however you’d like.
Lee: Actually, I’d have to go back. I had a very good friend here, that worked for Laser Pacific. He did a remote up in Seattle one day at the University of Washington and we’ve been good friends ever since, so it’s been about 40-years. And I would come down from Seattle and visit him and I thought, “God, this would be a great place to live!” You know, it’s like, *looks around* whoa! *laughs* You don’t get that in Seattle. You don’t get this kind of… what would you want to call it?
Karl: Atmosphere?
Lee: Atmosphere… or it’s, not that gay… openly. It’s like our own little gay community, it was probably a higher percentage then. I don’t think West Hollywood even existed then.
Karl: It was probably LA then.
Lee: Yeah, West LA or something. But it was really cool. *pauses for sirens driving by* It was really cool to be able to go out and join a group of “girls,” if I use the word loosely, for brunch or something. And Randy is also gay, he was a Chief Engineer for Laser, he’s done well there, he’s turned the company around there a couple of times, respectably. The reason we got to be good friends is I’d stay at his house up in Arrowhead, and eventually I said, “Someday we want to move down here.” After retiring, we did. Dave didn’t understand it. He was a Manufacturer’s Rep. for the gift industry and had his own showroom in Seattle, and his experience down here was not as cool as mine. He thought LA’s just a big, ugly city, not much going on. But after I came down here and started working, and he started visiting, he thought, “Oh, this is cool.”
Karl: Well, since you got here, what changes have you seen, if any?
Lee: I don’t think it’s really changed that much. You know back in the old days, I’d always say this, but you probably hadn’t even thought about it, but bars were gay, or not. And everything is becoming so mixed now, it just doesn’t matter. There’s not… well this probably is a more gay area than anywhere else, but I think it’s becoming more gentrified, or whatever you want to call it. The mix… it doesn’t matter, you know. Maybe gays are becoming more open because they don’t have to be so in the closet.
Karl: Is that a good thing? A positive change?
Lee: Yeah, I think so. Do you?
Karl: *laughs* Yes, I do, of course I do. But some people don’t. They think West Hollywood is being invaded, you know, “the decline of gayborhoods,” and whatnot.
Lee: *laughs* You know, I haven’t always been… I was married to a lady for a couple of years.
Karl: Here?
Lee: In Seattle.
Karl: Has she been down?
Lee: No, she hasn’t been down, we’re still very good friends. She has a lot of gay friends also, but she’s straight. She thought she’d have the best of both worlds. But it didn’t quite work out, but we’re still very good friends. She got impregnated and has a kid now, he’s grown up. She sent me a really nice card for my birthday yesterday. So it’s all cool. *chuckles*
Karl: What do you mean by, “She wanted the best of both worlds?”
Lee: Well, I guess…
Karl: Did you marry her when you were out already?
Lee: Oh, God, yes, absolutely.
Karl: I see. So it wasn’t like, in question or anything? I mean, why get married?
Lee: *Grumbles* She wanted to have a kid I guess, that’s the natural instinct.
Karl: Interesting. Did she approach you as a gay man, or you met that way and she’s like, “Hey, Lee, why don’t we get married and have a kid?”
Lee: Well, we had a lot of mutual friends and… yeah, we just got married. Just crazy, ran off to Idaho and got married. Drove over with my partner, well, not partner, my boyfriend at the time, or whatever you want to call him. He wasn’t really a boyfriend, he was a best man.
Karl: With the intent of having a kid someday.
Lee: Well, she did. I wasn’t ready for that immediately. It was a little bit of a conflict but not really.
Karl: Well, it’s a big thing. Kind of messes your life up a bit. *laughs*
Lee: Yeah, it’s like having a dog. *smirk* She came to the door once, and said, “By the way, want to meet my son?” And I almost fainted. She hadn’t told me. *laughs*
Karl: How many years were you with her?
Lee: Two. But we were good friends for maybe two or three years before that. And we’re still good friends. She’d love to come down here. She has a crazy guy she used to run around with down here somewhere, you know, he’s probably like me, crippled almost.
Karl: Was the marriage substance-influenced?
Lee: What do you mean by that?
Karl: I don’t know, were you guys, like, out one night partying and decided…
Lee: Oh no, it was premeditated. We were totally sober. We drove from Seattle to Idaho, we would’ve sobered up. *laughs*
Karl: What’s changed around your immediate area, your street, your building?
Lee: I think it’s pretty much been the same. It’s been an education for me, I never wanted to move into a condominium, I’ve always had a home.
*Karl’s food arrives*
Karl: Lee, are you sure you don’t want anything?
Lee: No, I’m fine. Actually, Dave is getting Meals on Wheels.
Karl: Oh wow, how’s that going?
Lee: It’s expensive.
Karl: Yeah, that’s what everyone says.
Lee: When this is over, I’m not going to continue it, its running about $1,000 a month.
Karl: Jesus, that is expensive.
Lee: Yes, it is expensive. But the food is to die for. I’m not that much into eating, I can eat anything.
Karl: How long has this been going on for?
Lee: 6-months maybe.
Karl: Wow. Well, what has 6-grand got you? Have you lost a lot?
Lee: 6-grand on?
Karl: It’s been 6-months, at $1,000 a month…
Lee: Oh, the food? No, we don’t have to worry about that, I mean, when I was working in Seattle, the Comptroller at K Smith gave me financial advice, and he has continued to actually… I’ve done well. Just for a cheap engineer.
*”Sex in the City” again*
Oh no… *Lee clicks “decline” on iPhone*
Karl: Decline? Ouch! *laughs*
Lee: I provide tech-support, and a signal to him.
Karl: You know there’s a… *talks while chewing* What’s her name… the mom from the “Brady Bunch…” Florence Henderson… provides a service, it’s like $20-a-month, it’s for seniors who have, like, no idea what’s going on with computers and stuff… The Floh Club or something.
Lee: Actually, the Tech Room works too, down by the 24-Hour Fitness, on Santa Monica. He *points at phone* got into trouble and I didn’t want to deal with it, I said to take the computer down to the Tech Room. They wiped it out, and lost everything in it, but anyway, whatever. He lets me put a satellite dish up on his deck, that was the exchange, and I provide a signal, and tech support.
Karl: Fair trade I guess.
Lee: Well, I don’t use satellite anymore.
Karl: Do you guys go out anymore? Much?
Lee: Oh yeah. We used to go out a lot more but now since we’re having such good food at home, we’re not having to cook anymore, and it’s in a quiet environment, and you have control of everything that’s going on. But, you know, we went to the Abbey yesterday for my birthday and got totally smashed on martinis.
Karl: Are you hung over?
Lee: Nah.
Karl: That’s probably the most popular bar in West Hollywood I would think.
Lee: “In the world,” according to their literature. It was voted the most popular gay bar in the world.
Karl: Have the places that you’ve gone out to changed much since you got here?
Lee: Actually, Basix is so close. And Hamburger Mary’s has great little baby-burgers by the way.
Karl: I agree.
Lee: You know, not much has changed really. We’re not really into the social scene, I mean at 71, you’re not too sociable. I mean it’s not our group, but it’s okay.
Karl: Yeah, that makes sense. I think a lot of people would prefer to do the cruises than have to deal with the bar scene here… And sometimes it ends up costing about the same at the end of the night, right? *laughs*
So, describe the community here, in West Hollywood.
Lee: It’s very positive. I mean, I love it because I can walk to my doctor, any number of bars, motels, restaurants, everyone’s very friendly. It’s almost like a small community. And a lot of eye-candy.
Karl: There are really attractive people here.
Lee: Yes. Of course the weather is to die for.
Karl: In the time that you’ve been here, has the place evolved for the better or for the worst, or not at all?
Lee: I think it’s pretty level. I haven’t noticed that much change really. Places come, places go, businesses come and go.
Karl: Do you think we’ve been effected by the economy?
Lee: I don’t think as much as the rest of the country.
Karl: What would you like to see more of in this city? Or less of?
Lee: No change. Well, I take that back… as I sit here, it would be nice if this street *points at Santa Monica Blvd.* were divided like it is further on down Santa Monica. Its a little less noisy, a little more people-oriented, but that’s not going to happen.
Karl: Are you happy here?
Lee: Hell yeah. *laughs*
Karl: Wouldn’t change a thing?
Lee: Wouldn’t change a thing.
Karl: That’s important. A lot of people can’t say that about where they live.
Lee: I’ve had really good luck I guess. Life has been good.
